| 00:13.55 | louipc | I'd say get rid of the whole footer thing |
| 00:14.12 | louipc | it's just fluff |
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| 01:21.03 | PrezKennedy | not fair |
| 01:21.18 | PrezKennedy | apparently there was one walking distance from where i live now about 5 years back |
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| 03:33.15 | starseeker | :-) |
| 03:34.41 | starseeker | I now vaguely remember reading that texlive was supposed to be the future, but given that they are STILL distributing their system via an ISO image I'm not really reassured... |
| 03:41.58 | starseeker | brlcad: Just curious - are there any plans to make the IRC archives searchable? |
| 04:47.09 | brlcad | starseeker: I've set stuff up in the past for the channel, but to date hasn't been anything worth maintaining until the new website goes on-line |
| 04:47.31 | starseeker | Ah, point. |
| 04:47.43 | brlcad | I could see setting something up afterwards though so that the channel logs are auto-archived and searchable through the site as docs or something |
| 04:48.21 | starseeker | It's often a good way to go back and find an earlier discussion on a topic, or at least I find it to be useful in #lisp |
| 04:50.37 | brlcad | yeah, I generally use my own logs for that - the beauty of a persistent server connection running irssi in screen |
| 04:50.49 | brlcad | but it would make a nice general feature |
| 04:53.16 | brlcad | I actually have a "complete" log of all my irc chatter ever stated/received/seen, going back many many years that I rummage through every now and then |
| 04:53.32 | brlcad | it's fun to read a conversation I've had with someone five years later |
| 04:53.44 | starseeker | :-) |
| 04:54.52 | brlcad | I think I even have old icq sessions stashed away from the mid 90's somewhere |
| 04:56.12 | starseeker | Such conversations can actually contain a lot of useful knowledge, advice and examples if you happen to remember the right keywords to locate 'em |
| 04:56.14 | brlcad | part of my data "archive" that has just about everything that I've ever done on a computer, I'm a digital pack rat purist |
| 04:56.58 | starseeker | As long as hard drives continue to expand faster than we generate logs, why not? |
| 04:57.13 | brlcad | GB's of spam logs that I used to even stash just for historical/hysterical purposes |
| 04:58.04 | brlcad | yeah, I've been constantly upgrading to the next biggest drive every couple years as I expand my capacity |
| 04:58.12 | starseeker | er ads |
| 04:58.29 | starseeker | Are they up to terabyte drives yet? |
| 04:58.44 | brlcad | yeah, WD has one for just a few hundred |
| 04:58.49 | starseeker | sweeet |
| 04:58.51 | brlcad | external enclosure |
| 04:59.26 | starseeker | and I thought this was a big drive at the time, darn it... |
| 05:00.06 | brlcad | you can actually buy 2TB externals pretty easily now, ever since hitachi came out with their single-drive 1TB's about a year ago |
| 05:00.25 | starseeker | Wow. |
| 05:01.32 | brlcad | I've had over a TB when it was more than a buck a GB |
| 05:01.47 | starseeker | Yeow |
| 05:01.55 | brlcad | heh, hell, I remember spending $350 for a 300MB drive back when my data archive was just getting started |
| 05:03.21 | brlcad | depends what you make part of the base OS |
| 05:03.31 | brlcad | is that just the kernel, or is that user-space too |
| 05:04.05 | brlcad | if it's user-space, is it just base command-line tools, or does it include a gui .. even for either, what apps are included and what are not |
| 05:04.37 | starseeker | I guess up to and including the full KDE desktop and supporting utilities/libs |
| 05:04.43 | starseeker | might be a useful benchmark |
| 05:05.59 | brlcad | I'd say for a general purpose OS that your traditional editors like vim and emacs are essential, and that already jumps you up to about 75MB :) |
| 05:06.31 | starseeker | point ;-). |
| 05:06.39 | brlcad | base command-line userspace is probably 100-500MB for 'everything' "necessary" |
| 05:06.47 | starseeker | Although some might argue with Emacs in there you're getting close to a full OS already... |
| 05:06.54 | brlcad | gui is probably 2x to 10x that :) |
| 05:07.58 | starseeker | Or I suppose you could take this guy's approach: http://www.menuetos.net/ |
| 05:08.04 | starseeker | :-P |
| 05:09.43 | starseeker | I guess as usual there are the tradeoffs between simplicity/transparency and performance in space and time. |
| 05:09.50 | brlcad | ahh, he's still at it |
| 05:10.06 | starseeker | you know him? |
| 05:10.46 | brlcad | no, not really -- but I read about menuetos about two years ago |
| 05:10.51 | brlcad | i think he'd just started |
| 05:11.13 | starseeker | Ah. I'm very impressed, but I can't help wondering if he's off his meds a bit or something ;-) |
| 05:11.57 | brlcad | yeah, pretty cool but exceptionally impractical |
| 05:12.33 | brlcad | lightweight, but lacking 90% of the stuff most come to take for granted |
| 05:13.03 | starseeker | Right. Reminds me a bit of that realtime OS demo someone made back in the late ninties |
| 05:13.16 | starseeker | Q something |
| 05:13.41 | starseeker | QNX |
| 05:13.43 | starseeker | that was it |
| 05:13.58 | brlcad | i mean, most/many OS's actually started like that with some "pure" philosophical approach... back in the 70's and 80's |
| 05:14.17 | brlcad | some in assembler, some C, some hybrid, etc |
| 05:14.27 | brlcad | heh, QNX is still around |
| 05:14.40 | starseeker | Yes, but I think they've move beyond floppy demos |
| 05:14.55 | brlcad | heh, far beyond |
| 05:15.11 | brlcad | qnx is one of the defacto OS's for embedded systems development |
| 05:15.16 | brlcad | one of the best RTOS's |
| 05:15.38 | starseeker | Yes, they got a lot of press a while back - there was some hope they'd go open source but I don't think it ever happened. |
| 05:15.55 | brlcad | they went open source a month or two ago |
| 05:16.04 | starseeker | Really?? |
| 05:16.41 | brlcad | unless I'm mixing them up with someone else |
| 05:17.02 | brlcad | yeah, two months ago |
| 05:17.03 | brlcad | http://www.qnx.com/news/pr_2471_1.html |
| 05:17.12 | brlcad | there was even a /. on it iirc |
| 05:17.47 | starseeker | Confound it, I always seem to miss the best slashdot articles and get the political rants... |
| 05:18.10 | brlcad | so you pick up on sage without skipping a beat, but entirely missed qnx :) |
| 05:18.22 | starseeker | Hehe - you spotted that eh? |
| 05:19.29 | starseeker | I caught the SAGE article, but it turns out I missed an earlier one (arguably more important) about the AMS opinion piece calling for more support for open source computational software |
| 05:21.02 | starseeker | Well hot diggity, Sept 12th 2007 |
| 05:22.05 | starseeker | brlcad: have y'all looked at SAGE at the ARL or is it pretty orthogonal to what you need? |
| 05:25.32 | starseeker | Meh - QNX is only free for non-commercial stuff. No wonder it didn't make a bigger splash |
| 05:46.10 | brlcad | fairly orthogonal |
| 05:46.41 | brlcad | at least for our primary purposes, I'm sure some analysts could put it to good use if they knew how |
| 05:48.56 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 05:53.12 | yukonbob | hey brlcad. What's shaking? |
| 05:55.52 | brlcad | not much |
| 05:56.13 | brlcad | getting ready to have teeth finally ripped out of my head |
| 05:56.32 | yukonbob | wisdom teeth, or other "bad" teeth? |
| 05:56.34 | brlcad | been at least a decade in the coming |
| 05:56.38 | brlcad | wisdoms |
| 05:56.48 | yukonbob | had 4 done at once. |
| 05:57.21 | brlcad | yeah, I got to get all 4 out, horribly impacted, but I'm going to do them two at a time |
| 05:57.49 | yukonbob | something in tea is a good thing for the wounds -- stuff a moist tea bag in your mouth if you need it (/me would have to research to find out what it does at all...) |
| 05:59.14 | yukonbob | http://www.tricountyoms.com/surgical/wisdom_tooth_removal.html -- search for tea bag |
| 06:03.06 | brlcad | yeah, the tannic acid |
| 06:03.13 | brlcad | use them in crew too |
| 06:04.03 | yukonbob | ?"in crew" |
| 06:04.03 | brlcad | they can help anethestize and harden up your hands for rowing if you're not yet callous or if you're blistered |
| 06:04.03 | brlcad | crew rowing |
| 06:04.09 | yukonbob | ah |
| 06:05.11 | brlcad | iinteresting |
| 06:05.17 | brlcad | that's a new one to me |
| 06:05.46 | yukonbob | get ``Erik to try it out after some red-eye experience and let us know if it works. |
| 06:07.41 | brlcad | I get red-eye after a really intense cardio workout in the gym |
| 06:08.05 | brlcad | sauna can do it too, whenever I push up past 95% of my MHR for a long period of time |
| 06:08.40 | brlcad | or otherwise exhaust extensively |
| 06:08.44 | brlcad | i might have to try that sometime |
| 06:15.59 | yukonbob | so I was trying to get the imgs into my docbook work other day, and the only thing that I can get to work is using ps/eps -- can't source jpg, png, gif, etc. |
| 06:17.09 | yukonbob | I still have more I can dig for to see what's going on (/me believes it's TeX not knowing the size, and needing a parameter, but I don't know how to send it to TeX w/i the Docbook realm)... |
| 06:17.15 | brlcad | if you can get ps to work, everything else should be trivial |
| 06:17.55 | yukonbob | well, I can use .ps. It's not the ideal format for all gfx, but it does work. |
| 06:18.05 | brlcad | oooh, using ps just for the images |
| 06:18.09 | brlcad | though you meant as the output fmt |
| 06:18.14 | yukonbob | oh no --- |
| 06:18.18 | yukonbob | for including the gfx. |
| 06:18.33 | brlcad | odd that the image formats wouldn't work |
| 06:18.40 | brlcad | they have sizes embedded |
| 06:18.46 | yukonbob | ps (eps) works nice because TeX knows it's size by the %boundingbox |
| 06:20.01 | yukonbob | *done it before with pure LaTeX |
| 06:26.26 | brlcad | you're using jade? |
| 06:26.43 | brlcad | it's supposed to be fairly seamless for embedded imagery |
| 06:27.17 | yukonbob | well... |
| 06:27.33 | brlcad | yeah .. "supposed to be" |
| 06:27.37 | yukonbob | it may be -- but atm I haven't figured out the incantations required |
| 06:27.43 | brlcad | going by tests from many years ago and second hand comments :) |
| 06:27.56 | brlcad | have fun :) |
| 06:28.00 | yukonbob | ;) |
| 06:28.19 | yukonbob | I'm sure it's possible -- it's too basic a thing to not have been solved. |
| 06:28.37 | yukonbob | The info just isn't readily available when I want it ;) |
| 06:29.12 | yukonbob | after I figure it out -- every search I do, every article I read, every conversation I have will contain this info... but in the meantime, it elludes me ;) |
| 06:29.45 | yukonbob | ?eludes |
| 06:31.02 | yukonbob | *eludes |
| 06:31.12 | yukonbob | . |
| 06:32.03 | poolio | ah, I have to learn latex for next semester : |
| 06:33.08 | yukonbob | poolio: it's neat. Emacs + AUCTeX are your friends. |
| 06:34.27 | poolio | heh, I still haven't tried out emacs...still using good 'ol vim |
| 06:34.28 | yukonbob | ...and the "Not So Short Guide to LaTeX" |
| 06:35.20 | yukonbob | poolio: what do you need it for? |
| 06:35.48 | poolio | A math course I'm taking requires homework be typed |
| 06:36.07 | yukonbob | what OS do you run? |
| 06:36.50 | poolio | yukonbob: currently linux, sometimes freebsd |
| 06:37.47 | yukonbob | mm --- you'll probably want to install teTeX (Thomas Essers distro of LaTeX (Leslie Lamports extensions to TeX (Knuths typesetting language)))... |
| 06:38.09 | poolio | Wow, am I reading English or LISP :) |
| 06:38.22 | yukonbob | T |
| 06:38.23 | yukonbob | ? |
| 06:38.42 | poolio | ah nothing, just lots of parathesis |
| 06:38.48 | poolio | I think I missed an n in there... |
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| 12:51.24 | starseeker | yukonbob: Just curious - which tex distribution do you have installed? I just switched over to texlive after being reminded that tetex is no longer maintained |
| 12:51.52 | starseeker | I see you recommending tetex, but that might not be the best long term option... |
| 12:52.16 | starseeker | poolio: You might want to check out Lyx or TeXmacs if you prefer a GUI to straight LaTeX |
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| 14:16.18 | ``Erik | ooh, tcl 8.5 in debian testing now |
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| 16:02.57 | Z80-Boy | I want to put a picture on a background of rotating BRL-CAD model video |
| 16:03.16 | Z80-Boy | And want to be sure it works reliably even if the model happens to contain the same colour as the background |
| 16:05.18 | Z80-Boy | I would also like to get the output RGB in double format, because then I could calculate the maximum channel value and auto-exposure it so it doesn't get neither under-exposed or over-exposed |
| 17:52.44 | minute | brlcad: Thank you, any idea when you'll be able to take a look at LDAP? |
| 17:53.55 | minute | And darn, I forgot about the broken footer. |
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| 18:03.19 | ``Erik | minute: probably not for at least a few days, he's somewhat incapacitated :) fistfight with a tire iron or something |
| 18:14.53 | PrezKennedy | ouch... is brlcad ok? |
| 18:25.13 | minute | ``Erik: I hope that was metaphorical. ;) |
| 18:29.31 | ``Erik | hehehe I've probably said too much :D he'll probably be online soon, but probably not tearing into code or sysadmin stuff |
| 18:31.03 | minute | Sure. |
| 19:09.04 | ``Erik | <Mercury> emacs sucks, literally, not a insult, just a comment that its large enough to have a noticeable gravitational pull... |
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| 19:46.01 | archivist | hehe |
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| 20:56.47 | yukonbob | starseeker: I'm using teTex -- I looked into texlive briefly -- I haven't swapped out because atm, I don't know what the point would be -- I have _not_ dug too deeply into the differences, but at it's age, I can't see there being radical differences between texlive/tetex, as the result of massive bug fixes, for example.. . |
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| 22:58.49 | ``Erik | a/det |