IRC log for #brlcad on 20080929

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04:36.37 yukonbob wow -- hope everybody is having a good weekend ;)
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10:23.48 claymore stretches.
10:24.04 claymore Great weekend. The Amazing Race finally started.
10:25.55 louipc Great weekend. Had a wild party with a bunch of smoking hot women.
10:26.23 claymore Always a plus. Personally though, women who smoke turn me off majorly... ;)
10:26.43 louipc hahah
10:27.12 claymore hows that Forum addage go.... "Pics or it didn't happen?" yeah, thats it!
10:29.10 louipc aw shucks I never carry a camera with me
10:32.01 claymore Well its just a saying. As long as YOU remember what happened! Thats the problem with the really GOOD parties, not many people remember what happened....
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12:45.27 starseeker yawns and heads in
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14:04.58 mafm hello
14:13.15 clock_ claymore: they can videotape it
14:32.10 claymore True, but those vids are a dime a dozen on youtube :/
14:43.02 clock_ how many $ is a dime?
14:43.07 clock_ and a nickel?
14:43.21 claymore Dime = $0.10
14:43.28 claymore Nickel = $0.05
14:46.22 clock_ do other coins have special names like these?
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14:51.46 claymore Penny = $0.01, quarter = $0.25
14:54.00 clock_ is there a 0.02 and 0.50 coin?
14:54.27 claymore No and yes, but the $0.50 is pretty rare and not very used.
15:00.40 clock_ so if you want to pay 0.04, you have to use 4 0.01 coins?
15:01.05 claymore yes. But nothing costs 4 pennies. Not even 1 peice of bubblegum.
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15:05.10 clock_ 1.04 then?
15:06.23 claymore sure.
15:44.06 ``Erik heh
15:46.09 ``Erik made his gf stop smoking, :/
15:46.56 brlcad so you think
15:52.49 ``Erik no, she actually did, I don't hear the end of it.
15:53.37 ``Erik http://librivox.org fear
15:53.57 claymore She is probably getting the best of both worlds... still smoking AND being able to give you shit.
15:54.06 claymore ..thinkabout it ;)
15:54.19 ``Erik sorry, my nose works... :D
15:54.38 ``Erik aint' exactly something that can be hidden
15:54.59 claymore ah, I thunked you two had a few miles distance between yas.
15:55.53 ``Erik a few, yes, but the two week visit vacations, hiding something like that would require siginificant downtime before and is just... not... doable... :D
15:56.15 claymore thnx for the librivox link. good stuff.
15:56.32 claymore I just started re'reading' the Dragonriders of Pern series again.
15:56.37 ``Erik caught it off of the vlog of a webcomic artist, the chick who does 'devils panties'
15:57.08 ``Erik jennie beeden or something
15:57.23 ``Erik breeden
15:58.03 ``Erik my dad was a huge dragonriders of pern fan, he even bought the board game
15:58.24 ``Erik I never got into it
15:58.35 claymore found a dir of comics, many of which you would probably like: http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/
15:59.03 claymore My favorite is the first book (chronologically) of the series: Dragons Dawn.
15:59.05 ``Erik heh, xkcd has been on my regular read list for years
15:59.20 claymore its about the inital colonization of the planet.
15:59.36 ``Erik I did some php hackery many many years ago, it currently lives at http://brlcad.org/~erik/comics/comic.php
15:59.58 ``Erik which is its third or fourth home O.o
16:00.11 claymore I remember the name, you mentioned it one time, but this is the entire archive... (I thinks)
16:00.14 ``Erik hosts come and go, but revision controlled code is forever
16:00.45 claymore I swear I heard a violin leading some epic music as you said that.
16:01.01 ``Erik yeh, usually, uh, when a comic makes it to that php script, it means I've gone back and read the ENTIRE archive
16:01.20 ``Erik I'm anal like that
16:01.44 ``Erik one does not just CLICK into mordor!!!
16:01.54 claymore So does Sean always lurk or did i forget my deoderant today?
16:02.14 claymore lol
16:02.18 ``Erik both, I'd imagine
16:02.32 claymore 'Ba-doom ching!'
16:03.23 ``Erik naw, deep irc geek culture involves reading a lot of backlog, having a semi-mystical ability to skip large chunks if it doesn't seem relevant, and conversations where responses might come a week after
16:03.42 ``Erik and a dozen simulanious conversations all being handled appropriately, if slowly
16:04.11 claymore newbie question: Is there a way for me to filter all the 'joined room' and 'left room' screen vomit?
16:04.24 ``Erik uhhhh, depends on the client? I d'no irssi myself
16:05.02 ``Erik BX recently added collapsing that, so if a netsplit happens, I see "17 people have left" instead of 17 lines of people leaving, or "netjoin, 34 people back" instead of 34 join lines
16:05.50 claymore BX = ?
16:05.56 ``Erik BitchX
16:06.06 ``Erik ircII descendant, like EPIC
16:06.35 claymore kk danke
16:06.51 ``Erik back in "the day", the two serious clients were BX or ircII/T|X
16:07.02 ``Erik and then there were the fucktards using winirc or mirc
16:07.28 claymore you sound bitter
16:07.39 ``Erik tx was written by shaman, but he had a very classic ircII approach
16:07.40 claymore were you a fucktard?
16:07.49 ``Erik the epic/BX approach was... niftier
16:08.07 ``Erik yes :D I used winirc first, then later moved to mirc... then bitchx, tried ircII, irssi, etc...
16:08.29 ``Erik bx is still a solid win for me, I'm the old guy it the rocking chair shakin' my cane from the porch
16:08.34 claymore NIFTI = Naval Infrared Firefighting Thermal Imager
16:09.16 ``Erik I made a bad hit in ae. now I'm looking at edge targets and getting all pussified out.
16:09.18 ``Erik :(
16:09.43 claymore </topic> You should read some of the threads in the AE-Artwork forum.... omg. id10ts, all of em. Well except maybe one or two.
16:09.52 claymore make more fleet.
16:09.59 claymore thats all I had time for this weekend.
16:10.12 ``Erik I'm building, the queues stay full, but, dude, it takes a week to ship 'em to the hot spot
16:10.15 claymore Cooked up another 200k, fresh from the oven.
16:10.33 claymore There will always be more targets....
16:10.47 ``Erik I'm tempted to just kamikaze crap to burn off my fleet in 32 so I can be excused
16:11.21 claymore I AM pretty upset about sitting my fleet in33 for 2 weeks awaiting this EPIC mission we are going on.... only to be told its a farming run of hte 30's
16:11.29 ``Erik I still wear the student moniker, so I imagine I'm permitted a fair bit of leeway
16:11.32 claymore lol you too? hahaha
16:12.14 ``Erik compared to the guys who've been dropped, I've been highly active and seem to be on the curve well enough
16:12.16 claymore I am planning on just hitting a bunch of targets, making it as profitable as possible. But just keep going and going until I have nothing left in the lower 30s
16:12.21 ``Erik they dont' think I need a mentor
16:12.39 claymore Hey, that b3n_k1ng fool has ALL of his bases in 37.
16:12.45 claymore shitty defences too.
16:12.50 ``Erik yeah, I'm at the point where I don't even care about profit, really... it'd be nice, but *shrug*
16:13.10 ``Erik I won't hit a former guildie.
16:13.40 claymore Thats my normal motto... but man... this guy... logs on once every 5-6 days and only builds JGs and tech....
16:13.44 ``Erik it's a low blow, having someone expose their tech and locations, then booting and romping them, it just ain't cool
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16:13.57 ``Erik I'll give him a week or two
16:14.10 claymore Well, I knew where he was for a long time before he posted all his locs.
16:14.21 ``Erik the savage boot&farm approach is uncool with me
16:14.40 claymore we 'grew up' togther. *snif* now I have to destroy his ass :)
16:14.46 claymore Agreed.
16:14.57 ``Erik if EM comes back, I'll go there in a heartbeat, for a more civil nicer approach
16:14.57 claymore Yoda seems to be quite eager to do it though.
16:15.22 ``Erik yeah, fates culture is one of bullying and smashing everything around
16:15.26 claymore Oh yeah, forgot about the EM Redeux idea. Hear anythign form hellbent on that?
16:15.31 ``Erik nope
16:15.34 claymore bah.
16:15.55 claymore Whats worse is that the game mechanics lend itself to Fate's play style.
16:16.11 claymore Something to keep in mind as I build my own game....;)
16:16.26 claymore Anyone play 'Sins of a Solar Empire' ?
16:16.30 ``Erik yeah... I still hold myself to classic EM rules... if I romp a base, once I get the derbz, I leave a single fighter and don't mind them freeing themselves
16:16.51 ``Erik and I'm slow to hit tr's (though I've been ruthless on night)
16:17.44 claymore whats up with the TR pillage rampage? I lost 7 over the weekend.
16:17.52 ``Erik from who?
16:18.36 ``Erik I've been moving a single recycler to a base and doing the tr's with that for these night targets... they hold no fleet over their bases, so *shrug* why not?
16:18.54 ``Erik seriously, dude, I am plundering rt's with single recyclers. :D how awesome is that?
16:18.59 ``Erik tr's
16:21.19 claymore lol Garbage Men Strike Back.
16:21.20 claymore Nice.
16:21.37 claymore This down in 33/32?
16:21.54 ``Erik I've been engaging in 32
16:22.57 claymore kewl. I moved my fleet in 32 once, then logged right off. Had a hutch to build.
16:23.15 claymore I'll admit, the playability of AE is begining to wear thin.
16:23.34 claymore I am only lvl 35 and I am close enough to Endgame that its borderline boring.
16:24.08 ``Erik yeah, see, here I've found 5 more of this madhatter dudes astros
16:24.15 ``Erik no fleet.
16:24.27 ``Erik I'm gonna go scout tap piracy on his ass
16:25.48 claymore are there level restrictions on TR piracy?
16:26.54 ``Erik I'm sure
16:27.36 ``Erik at this point, I'm just looking to insult, though :D
16:27.58 claymore what reg are you in?
16:28.14 ``Erik mostly 32:4
16:28.16 ``Erik 46
16:28.33 claymore ah, you went west.. i went east.
16:28.36 claymore 48 sucks.
16:28.50 ``Erik I sent scouts out to 4 regions
16:29.00 ``Erik this one seemed the juiciest, so I've been ignoring the others
16:29.38 claymore sassy.
16:29.56 claymore so how was yoru weekend?
16:30.12 ``Erik seems to me that the weak players will try to collet at the center of a galaxy, to hav e'friends' close
16:30.35 ``Erik meh, was a weekend... friday morning, I woke up, sat at the lappy in the kitchen, vomited in the coffee mug and called in.
16:30.55 ``Erik still doing weekend, since it's my rdo
16:31.29 ``Erik far too much paperwork to do when I get in tomorrow :(
16:31.39 claymore Well I figured. Sucks about the decaf vomit though...
16:31.48 claymore Hardcopy? Ewww? Why?
16:31.55 ``Erik uhm, eval shit
16:32.06 claymore oh yeah, that.
16:32.07 ``Erik I havne't worked that since the darth wendy departure
16:32.12 claymore lol
16:32.48 claymore She got a job with the Emperor down at the Death Star... nice.
16:32.48 ``Erik it's really sad, she doesn't mean ill will, she is just not wired to deal with the CS type folk
16:33.16 claymore Well then, who is she wired to deal with... and would you want to meet those people?
16:34.11 ``Erik I have no interest in those folk, but I believe she does have a viable role as an xo in a fomulaic setting.
16:35.26 ``Erik were I running a ship and needed someone to go rabid dog on details where versatility and imagination were a bad thing, someone like wendy would be a solid choice
16:36.52 claymore So team lead for the Morale Supression Team eh?
16:37.05 claymore 'The beatings will continue until Morale improves'
16:37.11 ``Erik depends on the teams goal
16:37.50 ``Erik somethere where creative thought is involved and rules are an obstacle, ... she is not appropriate. :)
16:38.00 claymore lol.
16:38.25 claymore the Eng on my last ship would have hated her. lol.
16:38.37 ``Erik I think there are environments where free thinking may be a hinderance, and she may be appropriate
16:39.18 ``Erik I thought she was completely inappropriate as a bc over a SE team, don't get me wrong
16:39.50 ``Erik but I don't think she was intentionally evil, I don't think she is without utility... was just the wrong place to stick her
16:40.08 claymore He came into Maneuvering to order the Reactor and ER shutdown for port call in Port Canveral FL: "Ensign, the bars open in 45 minutes. A procedural Shutdown takes 2 hours. You have senior watchstanders on watch and I need a drink. Do you understand me?"
16:40.46 claymore We went from the Reactor Critical and steaming to shutdown/cold iron in 27 minutes. :)
16:41.07 ``Erik never fuck with a captains drinkin' schedule.
16:41.09 ``Erik :D
16:41.53 claymore well it was the Eng... the CO would have pooped golden bricks if he knew what we did. I swear the ER looked like we just ruptured a Steam Line. Visibility was at 1m at best. :)
16:42.40 claymore Me, being rather new at the time, was scare shitless but was told to "sit back and watch" by the senior Electricians.
16:43.45 claymore Fun stuff watching a cloud steam blow into maneuvering all the while hearing shouts of laughter from the Engineroom
16:43.48 ``Erik I d'no, I grew up on navy bases, did njrotc for a while, have worked under a significant range of bosses... a lot of 'em suck, most don't mean to suck, maybe I'm too forgiving in my old age
16:44.40 claymore Perhaps. There are some genuine idiots out there, they just don't know it.
16:45.03 ``Erik I think lisa grok'd that she was outclassed and tried to do right, I think wendy was too concerned with looking good and fucked shit up for that, I think steph just wants shit done and doesn't understand what people are telling her
16:45.15 brlcad claymore: xkcd is a staple of comic geekdom, I'm a little surprised you've just run across it :)
16:45.33 ``Erik I think drew is too damn scared about being blamed, I've called them the kindergarden crowd to bobs face
16:45.38 brlcad next you'll be saying you've never head of user friendly
16:45.52 ``Erik I think paul is too damn scared of being beaten on to do anything
16:46.04 claymore brlcad: Whats your nick all about?
16:46.06 brlcad always lurks
16:46.38 claymore lol.... kindergarden crowd.
16:46.53 ``Erik I think when mike hiked up to deleware for school, he made a damn brilliant choice
16:47.19 claymore brlcad: never really was into comics outside of the Far Side, so online comics are only about 3 years old to me.
16:47.30 ``Erik I think when justin jumped to drews team and started the georgia tech thing, he blundered into a brilliant decision
16:47.44 claymore and yes I have heard of User Friendly. There is one glued to the door of the mens bathroom at work.
16:47.56 brlcad catches up
16:48.17 brlcad claymore: which nick?
16:48.33 claymore bad attempt at sarcasm on my part. nm.
16:49.02 claymore I thought Justin was out on the island working with robotics/embeded stuff?
16:49.12 brlcad he is
16:49.44 ``Erik yeah, uh, drew W was doing robotics under wmrd and moved to vtd, taking his team with him
16:49.53 claymore on THAT Drew.
16:50.03 claymore I thought you ment F-ing Drew F
16:50.04 ``Erik justin doing aviotion and jason doing ground
16:50.07 ``Erik no
16:50.20 ``Erik not drew f, tha'ts lee's burden, justin is with drew w
16:50.29 claymore *confusing*
16:50.35 claymore I hate even pseudo politics
16:50.57 ``Erik amusingly, I met drew w well before justin moved over, in a social context
16:51.02 claymore oh yeah, Heroes is on tonight... don't miss it this time S ;)
16:51.04 ``Erik he fly's at sandy hook
16:51.38 claymore Sandy's my wife's name. What the hell is he doing with her hook.
16:51.43 ``Erik I was watching him do inverted helicoptor tricks before I cut my finger off
16:51.46 brlcad claymore: yeah, I know
16:51.49 ``Erik well
16:51.51 ``Erik dave
16:51.54 claymore :)
16:51.55 ``Erik we like your wifes hook
16:51.57 ``Erik a lot
16:51.59 ``Erik ...
16:52.11 claymore it IS rather nice ....
16:52.13 brlcad claymore: hit ctrl-n a couple times
16:53.02 claymore oh, so thats what that means. lol
16:53.14 claymore My life's on the net anyways, so I 'm not scared.
16:53.18 brlcad private messages and other channels
16:53.45 brlcad those are your "windows"
16:54.01 claymore Yes, when it comes to the l33t things you guys do, i am still driving my Big Wheel. So be patient.
16:54.14 ``Erik oh my, this madhatter boy seems to want a fight
16:54.45 claymore lol what did he do now?
16:55.06 ``Erik he raped my cyclers
16:55.17 claymore looks like vice versa actually
16:55.38 claymore his vettes got trashed by your cyclers lol
16:55.49 ``Erik no, I hit his 2 credit tr's... that's all I did to him
16:55.57 claymore ...so... is that 'trashcan rape' ??
16:56.08 ``Erik he went up on my cyclers, now he gets to feel it
16:57.29 claymore New definition of funny: Watching an ide freakout because you accidentally forgot to switch windows back to the IRC channel...lol
17:00.32 claymore Good pool from the forums: What Scifi uni has the best ships? BSG, Stargate, bab5, starcraft, starwars, startrek, EvE, Homeworld....
17:00.52 claymore pool = poll for illiterate clods like me.
17:02.19 claymore So how are things up in E59?
17:37.40 brlcad somewhere between stargate and startrek me thinks .. starwars units are mostly unshielded or easily unshielded, the death star would be shredded by an asgard or ori beam
17:38.37 claymore The death star has always stuck me as a 'compensation ship' much like those oversized F-350's with 35" tires and a 40" lift kit.
17:38.38 brlcad now a borg ship would be an intersting fight
17:39.20 claymore The poll was actually quite intersting... most people based their choice on looks, but a few on functionality.. thus a decent arguement broke out.
17:39.23 brlcad bsg ships are just weak
17:39.33 mafm Firefly has the best ships
17:39.50 mafm one of them as a intergalactic companion ship, with hookers
17:39.56 brlcad ff's were fun but also "weak" ;)
17:40.00 claymore I was pretty dissapointed wiht the New BSG... they used Missles and Projectile rounds... thats borderline lame!
17:40.33 claymore I like the design of FF ships... they feel real and look functional.
17:40.42 brlcad sg is the one that takes it way over the top in terms of power and realism, making for some impressively powerful toys
17:40.49 mafm brlcad: that's a superficial look on the matter, I look at the content of the ships
17:41.12 claymore I also like the way *some* of the BSG ships looked. Viper = stupid, but the Raptor... that looks like something us humans just might build...
17:41.46 brlcad mafm: depends what was meant by "best" in that poll -- I took it to mean best at kicking the other ship option's asses ;)
17:41.51 brlcad not best resort
17:42.03 mafm otoh I haven-t seen any of those, except for Star Trek and Wars (and played Starcraft, but I'm not aware of movies yet)
17:42.14 claymore The problem with SG(and the cool thing too) is that its soooo far abstracted from believable that its just plain fun.
17:43.15 brlcad liked farscape's moya
17:44.35 claymore neat link: www.merzo.net/
17:47.39 claymore brlcad: don't forget to level the playing field Asgard ship Vs Cylon ship is apples and oranges. If there were someway measure and compare the universes...
17:49.27 brlcad level the playing field?
17:49.55 brlcad isn't that the point of the comparison? :-) given the physics and powers involved, if you mixed them all together .. asgards would kick cylon ass :)
17:50.24 brlcad Hm, T????s???ss??
17:50.32 brlcad bahh, no unicode
17:50.42 claymore Well, Humans vs cylons in the BSG uni compared to Humans vs Asgard in the SG uni... different 'humans', or level of tech.
17:51.04 claymore Perhaps, 'Normalize the Human variable' is a good way to put it.
17:51.28 mafm Ünìcõdê FTW
17:55.44 claymore I don't speak unicode... what was that again?
17:55.45 mafm Stargate is the one with egypcian themes?
17:55.50 brlcad sometimes
17:56.10 mafm claymore: mine is Unicode with different accents
17:56.20 brlcad started with that, they started diverging from the egyptian theme after about 7 years when they ran out of material :)
17:56.35 mafm claymore: just to annoy brlcad ;)
17:56.46 claymore nice.
17:56.55 mafm I think that I only saw the movie(s), not the series
17:57.01 mafm I don't have time for series :)
17:57.09 claymore Stargate got caughtup in the 'Need a bigger/badder advisary spiral'
17:57.10 mafm last was Firefly btw
17:57.26 claymore Good series :)
17:58.53 mafm well, if you don't count Flying Circus
17:58.53 claymore I honestly hate it when a good series goes town the tubes because they run thin on material.
17:59.01 claymore Spam?
17:59.11 mafm the whole series
17:59.20 mafm 40 chapters or so
17:59.33 claymore lordy. Got time on your hands or something?
17:59.36 mafm but yep, Spam is in there
17:59.56 starseeker likes Dahak - needs to become a movie
18:00.10 brlcad claymore: hum, I thought SG actually got much better as they ran out of egyptian material
18:00.23 mafm well, I don't have TV since 2 years ago, and don't watch it regularly since 5 or so -- and last time I got some time in the evenings, yep
18:00.26 brlcad that latter 5 years have been much better than the first 5 imho
18:00.42 brlcad the new atlantis one is still under .. evaluation
18:01.01 brlcad some good/great, some needing work
18:01.28 claymore Well SG did get better when the diversified out from the Egyptian themes, but, imo, they kept introducing new Bigger/Badder races to offset the last Big/Bad race they introduced...
18:01.50 claymore Atlantis is *braces* my current fav (Save FF ofcourse).
18:02.37 starseeker ``Erik: If you're around, some autoconf advice would be much appreciated
18:02.39 claymore Atlantis has very solid characters and a good plot line. Addmittedly, the plot is wavering a little in seasons 3-4
18:03.02 claymore its always a bad sign when they start killing off major characters...
18:03.22 claymore just like its a bad sign when they keep introducing new bigger badder races :)
18:05.07 brlcad yeah, but that's also some of the best shows too :)
18:05.22 brlcad like the latest power beasts from last friday... good stuff :)
18:05.58 claymore Are you talking Atlantis? I am 1 season behind current on that one. I wait for the Dvds :)
18:06.03 brlcad gotta get yer butt kicked with nearly zero-effort from time to time
18:06.11 brlcad ooooh
18:06.25 brlcad heh, then I shall try to say no more (no promises)
18:06.32 brlcad pretty cool though (so far)
18:07.06 claymore lol. thats my favorite formula for a plot line: HUman race getting whooped up on. Matrix, Terminator, S:AB... many many movies/series fit that bill.
18:07.28 claymore Best part about Atlantis: They have Kaylee :)
18:09.12 brlcad tayla's more my taste :)
18:09.19 claymore Oh, does anyone have any news on the FireFly MMO?
18:09.40 claymore Agreed, but Inara >> all. She just didn't make it to Atlantis... :(
18:10.08 brlcad at least not yet
18:10.29 brlcad they left the option open for her to do anything after she ascended
18:10.49 claymore her = teyla?
18:12.08 brlcad her = inara
18:12.47 brlcad Adria
18:13.21 claymore lol, i totaly forgot she's in the SG uni also. lol. My life is now complete.
18:24.20 claymore Preference Question: What do you prefer, FPS or RTS games?
18:25.49 brlcad adventure
18:26.10 claymore Cite example...
18:26.59 mafm nethack?
18:27.47 brlcad Quest for Glory, Space Quest, King's Quest, old infocom games, The Longest Journey, Kyrandia, etc ...
18:28.08 claymore Not many modern games do it for you then eh?
18:28.22 brlcad "it depends"
18:28.38 brlcad but yeah, most of the modern FPS don't do it for me at all
18:28.50 brlcad The Longest Journey is modern
18:29.16 brlcad there are a couple other modern adventures.. there are usually one or two exceptional ones every other year or so
18:29.35 claymore ...perchance a Final Fantasy fan?
18:33.37 brlcad never really played it
18:34.07 claymore ;) they are a series of games...12 or 13 now I think lol.
18:34.39 brlcad yeah, I know -- I used to follow the game, just never played it
18:34.47 brlcad more of an RPG ala Ultima
18:34.50 claymore The longest Journey... that sounds familiar. Is it puzzle based?
18:35.08 brlcad puzzle-based? mmm.. not exactly
18:35.22 brlcad it's an adventure, so there are naturally puzzles and mysteries in the game
18:35.29 brlcad but I wouldn't say it's "puzzle based"
18:36.09 claymore Screenies look cool. Good 100% puzzle based gmaes like the Myst series piss me off after a while. especially after I waste hours on something that turns out to be obvious. grrrr.
18:38.38 brlcad the artwork is gorgeous
18:38.52 brlcad screenshots on their site don't do it full justice either
18:39.17 claymore It looks like a 2D/3D hybrid...
18:39.37 brlcad most adventures are
18:43.09 claymore ..Bummer, the Bailout bill was reject by the House. Dow is down by 700 points.... not good. not good.
18:47.56 brlcad which makes me buying a place right now either really really good or potentially really bad :)
18:48.40 claymore Just wait for the housing market to crash a bit more, then buy in nice and cheap.
18:48.59 claymore So have you decided on whether you plan on renting or buying?
18:49.02 brlcad it could keep crashing for another year
18:49.07 brlcad housing-wise
18:49.41 claymore Sure could, but its just like any other investment.. buy low, but no one knows when the negative peak will be.
18:49.56 brlcad it's been tanking for about 9 months now
18:50.33 brlcad true, so I might not optimize the return, but it would/should still be a good deal unless it tanks for like 2-3 years
18:50.40 brlcad then i'm just joining in on the fun
18:51.35 claymore Well, unless this is the Big Crash that is goung to take down our country, the economy will heal and, given time, will turn any real-estate investment profitable.
18:52.13 claymore As long as someone doesnt buy low and sell lower, it shouldn't really affect them.
18:52.28 brlcad yeah, I just don't necessarily want to *have* to wait 10 years for a healing :)
18:53.19 claymore Well with BRAC happening, certain areas will be Residential Real-Estate investment heaven.
18:54.17 brlcad yeah, and I think of the areas being worked .. the places I'm looking at are likely to recover quickly (they've barely dropped as it is compared to some places)
18:54.33 brlcad i'm still keeping my options open though, have to find the "right place"
18:54.59 claymore Bah, find a fixer and flip it when the market turns :)
18:57.34 claymore I hear Dundalk is nice this time of year. *snicker*
18:57.40 brlcad neat, autodesk is sueing solidworks
18:59.59 claymore Can't find the article. Linkage?
19:00.15 brlcad buys a glacial against all the advice to the contrary
19:01.17 brlcad http://www.autodesk.com/us/solidworks/Document.pdf
19:01.44 brlcad it's the same deal as autodesk suing the open alliance
19:01.52 brlcad usage/representation of "DWG"
19:02.02 brlcad and a few more things for solidworks
19:03.23 claymore This reads like someone stamping their feet and pouting...
19:05.19 starseeker brlcad: OK, help. Where's a good configure.ac example of nested enabling? (e.g. if docs enabled, if pdf tool found, enable pdf tool style logic)
19:05.28 brlcad starseeker: heh
19:05.35 brlcad i'm already working on that
19:05.48 brlcad build failures necessitated some hackage
19:05.54 starseeker thought this would be so easy...
19:06.18 brlcad you had a handful of things 'quirky', couple things wrong
19:06.28 starseeker sorry :-(
19:07.00 claymore Ease up on himbrlcad, geez!
19:07.00 brlcad why is pdf generation separate
19:07.08 claymore ;)
19:07.15 starseeker deserves it
19:07.25 brlcad that's not being hard on him .. :)
19:07.47 claymore thinks sarcasm is harder to relay in irc....
19:08.07 starseeker should have had this figured out in an evening
19:08.16 claymore If you deserved it, lightening from upon high would have already visited you :)
19:08.27 claymore can't spel.
19:08.39 brlcad starseeker: what's the pdf generation separated out?
19:08.48 starseeker why you mean?
19:08.49 brlcad does it make it take hours longer or something?
19:08.57 brlcad why is there a docs and a pdf docs option
19:09.00 starseeker it might with the full doc build
19:09.05 brlcad instead of just a doc option
19:09.13 starseeker it's at least 2x longer than html or man
19:10.02 starseeker we can go for a docs on/off option if you prefer - I was just trying to be polite if someone wanted docs but not a prolonged pdf build
19:10.12 brlcad I could easily see saying that that is just how long it takes to generate the output formats
19:10.35 starseeker <grin> That might make the docbook option look less attractive in some eyes ;-).
19:11.47 starseeker But regardless, I'd like it to at least give me man/html if fop isn't present
19:11.47 brlcad i mean even if it saves them an hour building pdf docs .. that means the configure, compile, and install probably is going to take them more than an hour regardless .. so the savings is really minimal
19:11.47 starseeker True
19:11.51 brlcad sure, you can still make it autodetect and behave accordingly for a minimal set of docs or something
19:12.55 brlcad I just think from an outside user's perspective, we should be giving them all of our docs in all the formats we want to provide
19:13.54 brlcad dunno, maybe I just need to feel the pain for a while like you have been doing
19:14.22 brlcad but I would start simple regardless before trying to sort out the logic for both
19:15.58 starseeker OK, I'll see if I can simplify
19:17.05 starseeker If an AC_PATH_PROG doesn't find anything (say, for XSLTPROC) can I spot that in a Makefile.am with an "if !XSLTPROC"
19:17.22 brlcad which is sort of where my commit was going to take it
19:17.45 brlcad if you can give me a couple min, it might at least push things down the path
19:18.12 starseeker k, thanks :-)
19:23.42 claymore are you done talking about that work stuff yet?
19:30.01 brlcad wasn't talking about work
19:30.03 brlcad tis my hobby
19:30.57 ``Erik holy fucking shit, you guys talk way too much
19:31.12 mafm lol
19:31.17 brlcad and you drink too much, it all balances out
19:31.25 claymore lol
19:33.55 ``Erik stargate started off immensly awesome when the gould were posed as a terrifying race. it quickly lost that, though :(
19:35.26 ``Erik <-- flips brlcad off
19:38.18 claymore thats not very nice.
19:38.58 claymore takes an ACME anvil and drops it off a 105 story building, hitting ``erik on the head.. Meep Meep.
19:39.22 ``Erik I, uh, honestly can't recall ever claiming I was nice... :D
19:39.51 ``Erik in fact, I believe, I've claimed otherwise on several occasions
19:39.53 claymore Well, how much DO you actually recall?
19:40.10 ``Erik alrighty then
19:40.14 ``Erik flips claymore off, too
19:40.17 ``Erik :D
19:40.19 claymore lol
19:40.27 claymore feels accepted
19:40.39 ``Erik I'm literally laughing my ass off here
19:41.24 brlcad alcoholic mood swings will do that
19:41.26 claymore take pictures. I have never seen someone's ass fall off.
19:41.48 brlcad doesn't want to see pictures of erik's ass even if it is falling off
19:42.01 ``Erik for some reason, I can't get tegan and sara out of my head
19:42.09 ``Erik and, uh, burly, fuck off :D
19:43.33 claymore tegan & sara? Who Dat?
19:44.08 brlcad mhmm, striving to be a sailor today?
19:44.22 ``Erik band outta cankcia
19:44.37 ``Erik hit youtube and listen, uh
19:44.45 ``Erik "walking with a ghost" was one of their bigger ones
19:46.22 claymore eh, mute'n'watch video.... perhaps I will try another.
19:46.45 brlcad you can pull a stream on last.fm
19:47.46 claymore eh, from what I have seen so far, I think I might pass on that.
19:48.12 ``Erik they aint' pretty, but they have a fun groove
19:48.44 claymore I am getting a serious 'cranberries' vibe form them.... I don't know how i feel about that...
19:49.09 ``Erik hrm, I d'no, I never got into cranberries, but I enjoy these kids
19:49.34 ``Erik not sure if I can make a statement of correlation and difference
19:49.50 claymore http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyp5we2ySDo
19:49.55 claymore cranberries.
19:50.27 ``Erik yeh, I rememeber that song
19:50.38 ``Erik not the same
19:50.59 claymore music, no. Voices are close imo.
19:51.23 ``Erik I'd disagree, and the focus is radically different
19:51.47 ``Erik cranberries are very political in a u2 sorta way, tegan and sara is more.. kinda goofy fun punk
19:52.23 claymore there was a nother song (that I can't remember the name of) that the canberries did. That 'walking wiht a ghost' song sounded so much like them that I thought they were a tribute band. Need to look i tup.
19:53.03 ``Erik *shrug*
19:53.39 claymore either way, i can take about 3-4 mins of those kinda voices before it gets to me :)
19:54.34 ``Erik yeh, I agree, neither band has the hours on end listenabilty of AiC or those
19:54.46 claymore AiC = ?
19:54.55 ``Erik alice in chains
19:55.02 claymore ah, agreed then.
19:55.26 ``Erik layne has a zomfg vocal ability that I think has never been equaled
19:55.28 claymore I have been spining Ride the Lighting recently... forgot ho wmuch lik like the earlier albums
19:55.30 ``Erik had
19:55.57 ``Erik meh, metallica was decent in the day, it really felt like cliff was the carrying factor, though
19:56.03 mafm heading home
19:56.41 claymore True, he was a major loss. As retarded as he is in real life, kirk is a damn good guitarist.
19:56.47 ``Erik I mean, the first 3 albums... awesome as shit... cliff died, 'and justice for all' was, well, weak, and the stuff after was shit
19:56.53 claymore The same could be said for lars.
19:57.00 starseeker I died?
19:57.15 claymore Didn you get that memo?
19:57.17 ``Erik no, dude, the awesome cliff, not you
19:57.21 ``Erik :D
19:57.34 claymore You failed to turn in your TPS reports and were thus killed.
19:57.48 starseeker TPS?
19:57.56 ``Erik cliff burton
19:58.13 claymore has never been in a workplace so devoid of Office Space knowledge...
19:58.30 ``Erik uh,yeah, . .. uh...
19:58.47 ``Erik we might need to fire starseeker
19:59.00 claymore Well, I am out. Gotta meeting with the Bob's. Cya
19:59.05 ``Erik m3 did tps reports for a couple years
19:59.09 *** join/#brlcad iandaletter (n=asus@217.118.79.35)
20:03.26 starseeker ``Erik: Sorry, distracted - was having a conversation with Mike
20:07.53 ``Erik heh
20:58.09 iandaletter where can i see examples of docbook?
20:59.38 PrezKennedy im thinking about buying stock in apple
21:00.16 iandaletter doc/docbook in source tree - can not find source tree,
21:06.03 iandaletter PrezKennedy: i'm about to marry your doughter... that younger one...
21:06.33 PrezKennedy jokes on you if she told you shes related to me
21:06.36 PrezKennedy i have no kids
21:08.09 iandaletter no, you have!
21:08.20 iandaletter from Monica!
21:09.19 iandaletter PrezKennedy: do you know english quite well?
21:09.43 PrezKennedy Nein ich sprechen sie Deutsch.
21:09.52 PrezKennedy :)
21:09.58 iandaletter What is right to say: "I was" or "Iwere"?
21:10.01 iandaletter i were
21:10.17 PrezKennedy i was
21:10.17 iandaletter he/she/it V-s
21:10.29 iandaletter and i/we V?
21:10.42 iandaletter why?
21:10.43 PrezKennedy I was/We were
21:11.25 iandaletter i was... no. "we were" and "i were", too
21:12.18 PrezKennedy I were is not correct
21:12.25 iandaletter ok...
21:12.29 iandaletter thanks
21:12.41 PrezKennedy were is for plural
21:13.32 iandaletter yes, but "he goes" and "I go"... I + V. not I + V-s, right?
21:14.22 iandaletter PrezKennedy: can you change the grammar laws? at least until this year?
21:15.04 PrezKennedy it would be even better to say "He is going" and "I am going"
21:15.58 iandaletter ok, but not when we say about regular events
21:16.05 *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net)
21:16.28 iandaletter ok, i just have some white or black spots in my grammar book
21:16.44 iandaletter ...in my grammar.
21:16.58 PrezKennedy grammar isnt fun... im terrible with german grammar
21:17.46 iandaletter but it is considered to be relatively easy... I want to know it, too - but have no time for this...
21:18.34 iandaletter there's a link at second entry to German grammar at my http://pastime-one.livejournal.com/
22:23.23 starseeker brlcad: Did you decide on a good configure setup?
22:32.32 iandaletter starseeker: so, DocBook is an .xml...
22:34.24 iandaletter how about that samples... fr, de, it, pe, sp are bad though... incorrect words... but teasing for those knowing these languages
22:34.58 starseeker iandaletter: Haven't had a chance to look yet - slamming through some paperwork right now :-(
22:35.08 starseeker iandaletter: Yes, docbook is xml based
22:35.31 starseeker doc/docbook is a subdirectory in the current subversion repository for BRL-CAD
22:35.46 iandaletter and what about e.g. the biggest section, mged's commands?
22:36.03 iandaletter ok, gimmme a alink
22:36.19 starseeker There's a reworking of the documentation for MGED's commands in the works - one docbook man page per command
22:36.25 starseeker hang on, getting link
22:37.28 iandaletter ok, and what can you say about the translation I've supplied to my letter?
22:37.39 starseeker http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/
22:41.15 starseeker I don't think we want to have all languages present in one document. For the case of MGED commands, it may be possible to have a language variable that points the help commands to a specific subdirectory
22:41.44 starseeker brlcad and I were discussing how to set things up for translations a while back - I don't think we had reached a definite decision as yet
22:43.52 *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202)
22:44.43 starseeker brlcad: What's our position on automatic translations? I'm thinking we probably need human verification of correctness at a minimum before they're accepted into the tree
22:48.47 iandaletter the main point of translation:
22:49.20 iandaletter 1. English is the main since program is English
22:51.04 iandaletter 2. English words are quite easy to understand, so translations are... just partial, a main explanation - just as I've done. Rather a way to... well, i don't know...
22:51.27 starseeker we're very much in favor of translations
22:51.43 starseeker the question is how to structure their storage in the svn repository, and how to handle quality assurance
22:51.46 iandaletter ok, but it can be included - since it is an open source (point 1)
22:51.53 iandaletter and (point 2):
22:52.17 iandaletter someone can easily edit it, since it is already formatted into the book
22:52.50 iandaletter starseeker: e.g. old mged_cmd_index.html
22:54.14 iandaletter command, then wide description on each language - then options, described on english - since interface and everything is English, and it is relatively easy to know English words worldwide
22:56.10 starseeker iandaletter: Are you talking about where to store the translations?
22:57.49 iandaletter yes, and at the same time - how to offer to someone, e.g. french, to vise the automatic translation - whilst he study commands
22:58.04 iandaletter yes, where to store?
22:58.21 starseeker We're planning to make all the docbook documentation editable through a wiki-style interface in Drupal (our user website)
22:58.39 iandaletter i would do it as "addition" to english description
22:59.47 starseeker I would prefer not to mix languages in individual files. For one thing, the file timestamps are an excellent way of keeping track of what has recently changed and which translations are not up to date. For another, it makes processing the docs into one-language files for output more difficult
22:59.53 starseeker I have another idea, however
23:00.03 starseeker There is an ability in DocBook called XInclude
23:00.58 starseeker It allows Docbook files to include parts of other files automatically. For translation files, we can "include" the main (English) version of the file in the translation
23:00.59 iandaletter well, don't know what drupal is, but as long as we edit it - why don't offer a bit funny automatic translation? Shall be included... It's not hard.
23:01.32 starseeker There may be licensing restrictions on the automatic output of a translation program - what does the license say?
23:02.08 starseeker For translated files, once the translation of the original file becomes complete the original included English version can be removed.
23:02.33 iandaletter I don't really know much in coding pages, though. Ok, then e,g, /.../mged/3ptarb8.xml on english, and "additions" to it on fr, de, and so on?
23:03.29 iandaletter EasyTranslatorDelux 4 for windows (through wine under linux Ubuntu 8.04)
23:03.35 iandaletter wait...
23:04.35 starseeker I was thinking docbook/en/mged/3ptarb8.xml and docbook/ru/mged/3ptarb8.xml with the russion version XIncluding the english version until complete.
23:04.45 starseeker but that's what I need to discuss with brlcad
23:05.45 iandaletter ok, looks good - but! you shall know
23:06.11 iandaletter people do not like to see tricky translations...
23:06.26 starseeker tricky in what sense?
23:06.42 iandaletter en, then the variaNT ON another language - that's the way
23:06.55 iandaletter when someone download it
23:07.10 iandaletter e.g. en variant - it is only english,
23:07.34 starseeker Oh, you mean not making it clear en is the main language?
23:08.04 iandaletter when someone downloads e.g. russian variant - it is english + partially russian variant, where "russian" is e.g. a wide description, whil
23:08.33 iandaletter ...while e.g. options are wrote still on english
23:09.10 starseeker The goal would be to gradually have the ru docs become fully Russian
23:10.21 iandaletter well, just.. ""100% english + 60% russian"" - as a recipe of russian version, or any another language... it is hard to translate... interface of the program remains english, since program was developed as english - and this is a main point
23:10.41 iandaletter ok, can i send you file?
23:10.45 iandaletter example?
23:11.10 starseeker Sure
23:11.28 starseeker However, the ability to have the interface of the program itself translated would also be of interest
23:12.11 iandaletter no, your last comment is potentially wrong!
23:12.52 iandaletter mistakes and hard-spelling - this is what it is. My friends hate translated interfaces
23:13.21 iandaletter some words have no place to be fit into the menu...
23:15.15 iandaletter "translated" means usually "cumbersome" - while people able and really know ebglish quite well, even at school
23:15.52 starseeker Well, I suppose that depends on the quality of the translation - I wouldn't expect that I could sit down with an English-*Language* dictionary and make a good interface translation
23:17.29 iandaletter ok, i send you: first command represent version 1 of translation
23:18.17 iandaletter and second command 3ptarb - version 2 of translation
23:19.23 iandaletter if we will have translated both options in manual and command promt in the program, it would be probably right - and we can do it
23:19.41 louipc wow lots of chit chat
23:20.36 iandaletter louipc: what do you think?
23:21.40 iandaletter starseeker: i'm sending at the rocket speed of 1.5 kbps
23:22.22 starseeker heh
23:22.25 starseeker ouch
23:22.27 louipc I don't know. I didn't read the chit chat.
23:22.28 louipc smiles
23:22.36 starseeker read the chit chat!
23:22.49 starseeker :-P
23:22.57 iandaletter starseeker: i think we can save a feature to see all available languages - as a feature (point 1), and...
23:23.12 louipc It's way too much. no way!
23:23.33 louipc you're making russian docs is that it?
23:23.49 louipc I think I heard something about french docs too?
23:24.00 iandaletter ...how can we ranslate command promt? if "help" is on ru, and promt is english - it can be a bit cumbersome
23:24.01 louipc heard/read
23:24.30 louipc which command prompt?
23:24.33 iandaletter louipc: fr, de, it, pr, sp, ru
23:24.52 starseeker iandaletter: Not sure what the best approach is there - need to take some time and think about it.
23:24.54 louipc there are some translators lined up eh?
23:25.07 louipc gettext wouldn't it be?
23:25.11 iandaletter command promt of mged - can be translated, too - but not just at once
23:25.21 iandaletter ok
23:25.30 iandaletter just:
23:25.44 louipc you mean "mged>" ?
23:25.45 louipc :P
23:25.51 iandaletter command promt of mged remains on english - right?
23:26.00 iandaletter louipc: yes
23:26.22 louipc no need to translate that one :P
23:26.45 louipc "attach (nu|X|ogl)[nu]?" could use translating sure
23:27.01 starseeker to English? ;-)
23:27.27 starseeker louipc: Is gettext the standard solution for translation?
23:27.33 starseeker isn't up on this stuff yet
23:27.34 iandaletter then translated variant contains same e.g. 40% of english language, and everybody knows english quite good to unerstand simple worlds - kids or grannies :)
23:27.35 louipc yes
23:28.31 iandaletter starseeker: you need to rethink another thing, i gues...
23:28.46 iandaletter "..guess..."
23:29.05 iandaletter it can be not a simple docbook...
23:29.06 louipc attach, attacher, juntar
23:29.25 starseeker iandaletter: how come?
23:30.00 iandaletter this manual can unite people who know en, sp and ru - and they will unerstand they're all the same, and we will've created a peace in the world
23:30.02 louipc it can if the tools are there
23:30.03 iandaletter starseeker: ?
23:30.12 louipc if the tools aren't there then make them :D
23:30.18 starseeker why can't it be Docbook?
23:30.31 louipc because xml sucks
23:30.36 louipc jokes
23:30.41 starseeker Heh.
23:31.12 iandaletter Then Docbook with features
23:31.27 iandaletter starseeker: how about a command promt after "mged>"?
23:31.32 louipc one fellow was adamant on arguing for TeX
23:31.34 iandaletter it is on english...
23:31.51 iandaletter starseeker: ?
23:31.55 louipc iandaletter: yeah like try 'in'
23:32.26 iandaletter well, i just say about the "policy" of translation...
23:32.35 iandaletter it can be different...
23:32.43 louipc yeah that can't be in docbook
23:32.57 louipc the program interaction/output
23:33.05 iandaletter "full" translation is always... non-creative...
23:33.25 louipc well, perhaps it could somehow but I don't think it would make any sense
23:34.05 iandaletter louipc: what sense?
23:34.24 louipc forget I said that
23:34.36 starseeker iandaletter: Ah, you're talking about the command prompt commands themselves. Yes, initially they would be English, since they are the literal representation of what is typed in. However, I would expect ru/ documentation to be in Russian except where expressing the actual command
23:34.46 louipc gettext is how you translate stuff
23:35.20 louipc what could be translated is stuff like: Enter name of solid:, Enter solid type:, Enter X, Y, Z of vertex:
23:35.58 iandaletter starseeker: as in files i've sent you? Just edit them, and send to me - i will do it as you wish... I want to know mged's comands - and I need it, well, soon
23:36.47 iandaletter louipc: but e.g. I know this english words from the age of 10 - no one really needs it!
23:37.20 starseeker Iandaletter: Heh - just got it
23:37.23 starseeker reads
23:37.26 Ralith iandaletter: plenty of people are far more comfortable in their native language than english, assuming they even know english.
23:37.36 louipc iandaletter: oh I thought that's what you wanted when you were talking about command prompts
23:38.19 starseeker iandaletter: I was thinking more along the lines of 3ptarb (the 2nd command)
23:38.34 iandaletter Everyone know english... I will work in www.code-aster.org soon - it is fully-french... - then i will have studied a couple of hundred foreign words + additional theory on eng 'n'such
23:38.46 starseeker iandaletter: Again though - I need to discuss with brlcad
23:38.51 starseeker he is the project leader
23:39.03 louipc ok so what are we talking about translation then?
23:39.09 louipc is confused
23:39.10 starseeker yes
23:39.17 starseeker translating the docs to multiple languages
23:39.55 starseeker iandaletter sent me an example translation of two of the MGED command docs
23:40.10 iandaletter Ralith: no, it is easy to translate it... words as "Enter", location - even too interesting, but it can be translated, anyway
23:40.21 louipc cool
23:40.42 louipc oh you're debating whether it should be in the repo or not?
23:41.01 starseeker The difficulty with any translation is how to store the translations in a coherent way - which is compounded in this case by the docs already being put through a major reorg
23:41.10 louipc hmm
23:41.29 iandaletter starseeker: i have one 300 kb mged_cmd_index.html - and i've sent you an example of first 6- or nine commands... in n, fr, de and hand-edited russian
23:41.29 Ralith translated docs, you always have an issue keeping them up to date
23:41.30 louipc doc/en, doc/ru? :P
23:41.37 louipc yea
23:41.47 starseeker Ralith: Docs, period
23:41.53 louipc yea
23:41.53 Ralith makes me wonder if perhaps no translations should be done when there is not someone who can be relied upon to keep it updated
23:42.10 starseeker our ENGLISH stuff isn't even up to date
23:42.39 starseeker but it's a problem that needs solving, and the community can be a big help (both with english docs and with translation)
23:42.50 starseeker what's needed is a framework within which that work can take place
23:42.58 starseeker that's what I'm trying to work out now
23:42.59 louipc yeah
23:43.01 iandaletter Ralith: there was a talk about wiki engine, it's not a big question - the answer is "Someone, who study brl-cad right now"
23:44.06 louipc tutorials would be handy
23:44.08 iandaletter starseeker: what if other language will be "a short addition" to original 'english' page?
23:44.23 louipc tutorials on how to make accurate solid models of real things
23:44.47 Ralith louipc: do you really need a tutorial for that after going through the mged tut?
23:44.50 starseeker iandaletter: That might be an OK way to start, but I'd really rather not mix languages except for the "English command" part of things
23:44.51 Ralith I only made it about 1
23:44.52 louipc not contorted unrealistic radio/candlestick thingies
23:44.52 Ralith er
23:45.01 Ralith I only made it about 1/3 through and I have a pretty solid idea how to model real stuff
23:45.09 Ralith (hehe, solid idea)
23:45.17 iandaletter it is just better, believe me... everything can be edited - not even somehow "properly" - but into DIFFERENT VARIANTS - AND IT WILL BE COOL, ANYWAY!
23:45.17 starseeker louipc: Heh - I'm hoping to get down to the National Archives one of these days and poke around
23:45.22 louipc I'm trying to make something right now and it's not intuitive from a machinist's perspective
23:45.39 louipc well not that it needs to be intuitive
23:46.14 starseeker iandaletter: I will discuss with brlcad tomorrow, if he is in tomorrow. Deciding how to set this up is not something I can do by myself - he is lead developer
23:46.23 louipc well once I figure it out I might document the process
23:46.38 iandaletter starseeker: ok, i'll send you e.g. first 10 commands of mged-cmd-index as separate files in directories /en and /ru
23:46.42 louipc or at least I will, in a very simple fashion
23:46.53 starseeker iandaletter: Excellent! Thank you!
23:46.57 louipc starseeker: nice
23:47.08 iandaletter ok, then i'll have supplied you with files today!
23:47.22 starseeker hopes they have enough engineering plans for U.S.S. Monitor to make a detailed model
23:47.42 iandaletter starseeker: i can save each command as docbook from openoffice, will it be right?
23:47.55 starseeker iandaletter: That will be fine
23:48.05 iandaletter ok
23:48.43 iandaletter then... later... I'm still ending up cam expert
23:49.01 iandaletter ok, i quit... morning...is here
23:49.02 louipc Ralith: I'm curious what's your occupational/technical background?
23:49.13 *** part/#brlcad iandaletter (n=asus@217.118.79.35)
23:49.43 Ralith louipc: hobbyist/student
23:50.18 Ralith largely selftaught with respect to the interesting stuff, but I generally know what I'm talking about
23:54.10 louipc well one thing I find is that I need a calculator when modelling with brl-cad, where I don't seem to really need it with autocad or solidworks.
23:56.31 Ralith this is probably because autocad and solidworks don't need exact numerical values for everything right off
23:56.36 Ralith and let you do things like snap
23:56.52 Ralith rather than a fancy tutorial, I suggest more effort be put into the new gui
23:57.08 louipc no I enter all dimensions in autocad
23:57.33 louipc but one example: I have to specify radius instead of diametre
23:57.46 louipc so I need to half it in the calculator then enter it
23:58.47 Ralith radius is a much more useful measurement.
23:59.36 louipc not when I'm dealing with diametres of a shaft turned off a lathe, etc

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