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| 00:22.50 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33910 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/coil.c: OK, can specify different ending types for the coil now - getting close |
| 00:31.35 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33911 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/coil.c: OK, probably not all the cleanup needed for freeing things in coil but its a start |
| 01:51.45 | PrezKennedy | woo one more driving class to go |
| 02:22.52 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=madant@117.196.135.9) | |
| 02:32.56 | ``Erik | w00t, then it's off to the slave mines to afford a car, insurance, gas, etc :D |
| 02:48.59 | ``Erik | huh, did malcolm mcdowell just call tony blair the queen of england? |
| 02:55.45 | ``Erik | http://www.motivatedphotos.com/?id=2627&d=1 |
| 03:03.10 | madant | :O http://www.motivatedphotos.com/?id=3759 |
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| 05:37.31 | brlcad | howdy madant |
| 05:37.55 | brlcad | ``Erik: hehe, nice |
| 05:38.26 | brlcad | fortunately I had mad skills long before I got the car |
| 05:41.02 | madant | hi sean |
| 05:41.21 | brlcad | madant: please tell me you're still a student.. :) |
| 05:41.31 | madant | had that interview i was talking about a couple of days back :) |
| 05:41.41 | brlcad | oh yeah, how'd it go? |
| 05:42.04 | madant | march is going to be my most productive month hopefully :) interview was fine.. just usual funny talk.. no serious stuff.. |
| 05:42.15 | madant | hopefully i am a student still ;) |
| 05:43.07 | madant | the results come out in a couple of weeks.. fingers crossed |
| 05:44.05 | madant | when is the org application deadline ? march 20th ? |
| 05:44.58 | brlcad | something like that |
| 05:45.01 | brlcad | ~gsoctimeline |
| 05:45.01 | ibot | gsoctimeline is, like, http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2009/faqs.html#0_1_timeline_5354032302481437_ |
| 05:45.05 | madant | oh 13th.. |
| 05:45.42 | brlcad | four whole days.. :) |
| 05:45.42 | madant | a reduction in the number of orgs and students is expectable right .. |
| 05:46.24 | madant | yeah seriously .. student application period is 10 days thankfully .. |
| 05:47.26 | madant | april 20th to august mid seems ok for coding |
| 05:47.27 | brlcad | the student application period would be extended a lot more readily than the org one |
| 05:47.48 | brlcad | the org one has never been extended iirc, the student one has several times |
| 05:48.47 | madant | yeah but i wonder whether larger number of applications is exactly what google is looking forward to this time.. |
| 05:49.06 | brlcad | well last year, the timing was horrible and applications were *way* down |
| 05:49.42 | brlcad | as the first week corresponded with easter, which pretty much resulted in nearly no applications from US and much of Europe |
| 05:50.01 | madant | anyways imho almost all open source organizations applied last year right ? |
| 05:50.02 | brlcad | which is great for the non-US crowd, but overall submissions were down like 50% :) |
| 05:50.22 | brlcad | yeah, there was like 500 or 600 orgs that applies last year |
| 05:50.28 | brlcad | with about 135 accepted |
| 05:50.54 | madant | but steadily over the years more and more students are getting to know about the existence of GSoC |
| 05:51.43 | madant | in my first year of gsoc there was only me from my univ .. then next year there were 3 selected , and last year 7 or so .. and maybe 100 applications ;) |
| 05:52.10 | brlcad | ah, 175 orgs |
| 05:52.12 | madant | are we making a poster ? |
| 05:52.21 | madant | 175 orgs last year :O ? |
| 05:52.39 | brlcad | 1125 students last year |
| 05:52.46 | brlcad | it'll be about 1000 students this year |
| 05:53.11 | madant | that's still decent :) |
| 05:53.19 | madant | hopefully the dropout rate will be lower |
| 05:53.40 | brlcad | unlikely |
| 05:53.51 | brlcad | that's been pretty constant every year |
| 05:53.57 | brlcad | about 80% pass |
| 05:54.14 | brlcad | 80/82/80/83 for the four years |
| 05:54.16 | madant | statistical certainty :P |
| 05:54.50 | brlcad | probably about about 20% should be failed that are passed |
| 05:55.40 | brlcad | topic discussed at the summit, giving bad students many many attempts to succeed |
| 05:56.27 | madant | yeah i remember a lot of discussion on the same even in the student group.. basically some mentors were really pissed off i think .. |
| 05:57.25 | madant | and besides the existence of only two checkposts is also a constraint |
| 05:57.59 | brlcad | madant: so you know, we may take a slot less this year if we're accepted .. but iff we are accepted, making more progress on any of last year's projects will be high priority |
| 05:59.07 | madant | hmm.. hows mafm doing ? would he need help in gui ? i mean slot for another student ? |
| 05:59.09 | brlcad | there's only two google checkpoints, orgs are allowed to do more (technically our checkpoints were weekly) |
| 05:59.24 | brlcad | I don't think mafm is a student any longer iirc |
| 05:59.32 | madant | oh.. |
| 05:59.56 | brlcad | otherwise, yeah, the gui needs to be continued |
| 06:00.40 | PrezKennedy | gotta make it simple for us windoze folk ;) |
| 06:00.51 | brlcad | I think I'd like only three students so more time can be spent working with the various projects |
| 06:01.09 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: all in good time |
| 06:01.13 | madant | is the ogre installation complicated in windoze ? |
| 06:01.32 | brlcad | not really |
| 06:01.38 | brlcad | it's the main platform iirc |
| 06:01.46 | brlcad | or at least one of them |
| 06:01.57 | madant | but not really 'just simply works' level either right ;) ? |
| 06:02.12 | brlcad | not much on windows just simply works |
| 06:02.41 | brlcad | not really worried too horribly about build system issues |
| 06:03.07 | madant | oh.. so major work is interfacing with libged etc. ? |
| 06:03.28 | madant | i mean adding functionality to gui ? |
| 06:03.42 | brlcad | interfacing with either libged or new geometry service, but moreso adding functionality to the gui |
| 06:04.15 | brlcad | he never did get to many of the usability issues, and the basic pervasive command framework |
| 06:04.24 | brlcad | context |
| 06:04.29 | brlcad | er, context windows |
| 06:05.03 | brlcad | i.e. actually make it *look* and feel like the ioe prototype |
| 06:05.11 | madant | ha |
| 06:05.18 | brlcad | lot of work |
| 06:05.33 | madant | yeah.. i have always felt gui IS A LOT of work. |
| 06:05.56 | brlcad | that's why it was really one of the main goals of the project |
| 06:06.14 | madant | all the more reason it should be done once and (approximately) for all properly :) |
| 06:06.30 | brlcad | mafm wanted to work more on the 3D interaction aspects and libged integration, though, which was also good/needed |
| 06:07.17 | brlcad | but particularly for a new gui, I think it'll get a lot more momentum if it looks good, clean, and modular right from the start even if the backend functionality isn't there yet |
| 06:07.35 | brlcad | coding complete |
| 06:07.38 | brlcad | deep not wide |
| 06:08.32 | madant | hmm.. modular is always good |
| 06:08.37 | madant | hmm.. i will wrap up this mathvm in a couple of days.. a good way to start march.. i have been dragging it along too much.. need to concentrate on actual parametrics and constraints.. |
| 06:08.56 | madant | *too long |
| 06:10.00 | brlcad | you know, another project came up a couple weeks ago that I was wishing I had that library for :) |
| 06:10.22 | madant | what was it ? |
| 06:10.29 | brlcad | at least we were discussing various metrics of the real world modelers that use brl-cad for modeling various assets |
| 06:10.45 | brlcad | and the topic of where the time is spent when modeling |
| 06:11.08 | brlcad | (for the guys that spend literally 8hr/day every day of the week most days of the year) |
| 06:12.30 | brlcad | of the time spent modeling, how much time is "new work" vs "rework" .. and particularly for the rework, there is an general feeling that the rework rate is 1) high and 2) closely correllates with the number of interfaces |
| 06:12.45 | madant | which is really the weirdest part.. i mean with the obvious gain of (significant) reduction in modeling time and changes ( particularly since most designs go through a lot of iterations) i find it really surprising that not only do open-source solutions exist.. not even a fully functional commercial solution exists |
| 06:13.22 | brlcad | i.e. that a lot of time is spent moving things around that relate to each other, but since there are no parametric values or contraints to tie objects together, that a lot of time is spent manually fixing the cascade changes that occur when something needs to be moved/changed |
| 06:13.37 | madant | *er i meant not only do open-source solutions not exist :) |
| 06:13.45 | brlcad | nods |
| 06:14.24 | brlcad | there are often commercial solutions, they're just closed source proprietary and you don't know that's what they're doing under the hood |
| 06:14.45 | brlcad | like one of the things we're working on now -- raytracing trimmed nurbs |
| 06:15.06 | madant | scratches his head |
| 06:15.09 | brlcad | there are a few papers on a couple techniques, but it's exceptionally hard to implement it and have it actually be robust |
| 06:15.31 | brlcad | yet many CAD packages do provide it .. just nobody publishes how they accomplished it |
| 06:15.47 | madant | ah that sucks.. |
| 06:16.49 | brlcad | a great paper that come out just last year actually did publish how they did it, but then they patented the process :) |
| 06:17.39 | madant | ok.. that i can still live with |
| 06:17.41 | madant | :) |
| 06:18.13 | brlcad | software patents, at least in the US, are very actively protected |
| 06:18.36 | brlcad | particularly for the major industries (which CAD is) |
| 06:19.00 | madant | oh i didn't mean copying it.. :P |
| 06:19.23 | brlcad | yeah, it's better than nothing |
| 06:19.29 | brlcad | might inspire a new approach |
| 06:19.35 | madant | exactly |
| 06:19.50 | madant | i really don't understand the concept of not publishing a nice idea |
| 06:20.08 | madant | let alone a nice implementation |
| 06:31.39 | jonored_ | That's odd... on ellipsoids and cylinders I seem to be able to slice properly with the order I expect curvatures to be in, but for a torus, it seems to be switched... |
| 06:34.05 | brlcad | switched? |
| 06:35.57 | jonored_ | As in I get the result I expect if I swap crv_c2 and crv_c1 for a torus, but not otherwise. |
| 06:36.28 | jonored_ | crv_pdir should always be the direction tht crv_c1 is associated with, right? |
| 07:15.19 | brlcad | jonored_: eh, wth are you talking about? :) |
| 07:19.42 | brlcad | there's the torus radius and then the radius of the tube itself, plus a position and vector to place/orient it |
| 07:20.06 | brlcad | says he'll pick up this talk later, must wander |
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| 11:29.01 | d-lo | mornin all |
| 11:33.17 | alex_joni | g'morning |
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| 14:02.24 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSoC 2008 Highlight: new prototype gui, check it out! || Source Release 7.14.2 is posted (20080207) | |
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| 15:14.04 | ``Erik_ | all my connection are belong to comcast :( |
| 15:19.31 | d-lo | suckage... |
| 15:19.46 | d-lo | well, you can always haxor da gibson! |
| 15:21.19 | ``Erik_ | rather haxor a fender O:-) |
| 15:23.49 | starseeker | tries compiling SCL on his box and winces - looks like Code Modernization will have to take place here, to say nothing of build system work |
| 15:24.03 | starseeker | alright, time to play in traffic |
| 15:24.24 | d-lo | So, I think FATE might be falling apart. Without SD there (and the fact that few listen to any one else) it might be the begining of the end! |
| 15:25.47 | ``Erik_ | heh, nifty |
| 15:26.02 | ``Erik_ | fng seems to have survived a handoff pretty well |
| 15:27.04 | d-lo | there were a couple of 'angry' posts about FNG guys pillaging FATE traderoutes, and a few "beat them like redheaded step children' jokes |
| 15:27.21 | d-lo | followed by a few piping up saying "Fate did that to me when i was in FNG, so stick it." |
| 15:27.27 | ``Erik_ | new people who were buggywhipped when found out |
| 15:27.33 | d-lo | quite funny akshuly |
| 15:27.58 | ``Erik_ | a bunch of newbs in 86 got pulled in, and after they got smacked, there was a lot of whining when fate was pillaging and even attacking fng |
| 15:28.42 | ``Erik_ | *shrug* I've barely put any attention to that game lately, and even less to wow :) too much code to do |
| 15:29.29 | d-lo | feck, besides my best efforts... gotta race condition to track down :/ |
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| 16:10.07 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSoC 2008 Highlight: new prototype gui, check it out! || Source Release 7.14.2 is posted (20080207) | |
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| 17:03.16 | jonored_ | brlcad: I don't think that rt_tor_curve works quite right, unless I am misunderstanding things. Unless I am mistaken, it assumes that the smaller curvature is always associated with the major radius, and then computes a direction for that curvature that is pointing around the cross-section of the torus... but that block of stuff in the conditional I don't quite understand. |
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| 17:17.34 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSoC 2008 Highlight: new prototype gui, check it out! || Source Release 7.14.2 is posted (20080207) | |
| 18:07.42 | brlcad | jonored_: what are you up to? |
| 18:12.16 | jonored_ | brlcad: making toolpaths which use arcs when the curvature in the plane of the path is nonzero. |
| 18:13.20 | brlcad | hm |
| 18:13.39 | brlcad | well something that may be of assistance, you can visualize the curvature computations |
| 18:14.14 | brlcad | there's a render lighting mode specifically for it |
| 18:15.28 | brlcad | rt -l 4 and rt -l 5 |
| 18:15.58 | jonored_ | I just finally got my head (and a computer algebra system) around the math to get what that the curvature of an arbitrary intersection should be. Oh, I'll take a look at that. |
| 18:15.59 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33912 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/coil.c: Start working out a way to support specifying multiple sections of coil with different properties. |
| 18:16.16 | jonored_ | Does one draw with one curvature and the other with the other one? |
| 18:18.44 | jonored_ | looks up the model. |
| 18:18.48 | brlcad | same curvature, different visualizations |
| 18:19.01 | brlcad | one is the inverse radius of curvature |
| 18:19.17 | brlcad | the other shows the direction |
| 18:19.32 | brlcad | so magnitude or dir visualization |
| 18:20.31 | brlcad | can see the actual logic in src/rt/view.c, look for RT_CURVATURE |
| 18:24.57 | brlcad | to be honest, I've not looked at the torus' curvature code in years and it'd take a while to digest what is going on there exactly |
| 18:32.25 | jonored_ | Okay. How likely is it that it might be almost all right but not quite? I'm pretty sure that at least it's not keeping the first curvature smaller than the second. |
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| 18:33.28 | jonored_ | (or is that expected behavior?) |
| 18:43.46 | brlcad | that's certainly possible, we find bugs in even some of the oldest parts of the code from time to time |
| 18:43.55 | brlcad | kinda really rare, but possible |
| 18:49.15 | jonored_ | Okay. I'll keep staring at it until I understand what's going on in the last bit that I haven't understood, and if I'm still convinced it's not right, I'll send a patch. |
| 18:53.24 | brlcad | sounds great |
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| 18:59.03 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33913 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/coil.c: More progress to getting multiple sections working in coil |
| 19:31.10 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33914 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (archer/archer.bat mged/mged.bat util/rtwizard.bat): Update CAD_VERSION. |
| 19:34.58 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33915 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/coil.c: Section processing is (sort of) working - looks like the pipe primitive doesn't like sections with anything different except pitch though. |
| 19:41.28 | starseeker | expects helix angle and pitch to at least work - sort that out after lunch... |
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| 23:11.16 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33916 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/coil.c: Clean up capping of 'default' endings - now nt=1 produces one turn of a regular coil by default. |
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| 23:46.30 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33917 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am coil.xml): Add man page for coil tool |
| 23:46.41 | brlcad | uh oh, time to move it :) |
| 23:49.04 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33918 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: two more items identified yesterday, top -u isn't working or the docs are out of sync and there is a view message if you try to change the view before displaying geometry. |
| 23:49.22 | starseeker | brlcad: on it :-) |
| 23:49.23 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33919 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Move coil into shapes |
| 23:51.17 | starseeker | that took more trouble that I would have guessed, but at least it's in there now |
| 23:52.02 | brlcad | fg |
| 23:52.16 | starseeker | can now generate the necessary shapes to do the remaining screens for the article |
| 23:52.19 | starseeker | fg? |
| 23:52.29 | brlcad | pics or it doesn't exist! |
| 23:52.40 | starseeker | ok... |
| 23:52.41 | brlcad | ~ww |
| 23:52.42 | ibot | Can I get a woot woot? |
| 23:52.54 | starseeker | goes for wonky... |
| 23:58.41 | starseeker | http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/coil_fun.png |
| 23:59.30 | ``Erik | dude, you broke your slinky |
| 23:59.39 | brlcad | neat |
| 23:59.46 | brlcad | can model my mattress |
