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| 02:09.21 | ``Erik__ | fucking goddamn motherfucking |
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| 10:31.31 | d-lo | Mornin! |
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| 11:42.23 | brlcad | howdy |
| 11:49.16 | d-lo | hai! |
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| 13:42.58 | ``Erik | takes a few to say some impolite things to the universe. |
| 13:44.45 | d-lo | ``Erik: Whats going on? |
| 13:45.32 | ``Erik | had a booboo yesterday, no car |
| 13:45.59 | ``Erik | nose drifted on me, the sheriff thinks mebbe something in the steering linkage broke :/ ate a curb, which is a biggie on something like that |
| 13:46.59 | d-lo | injuries? |
| 13:47.04 | ``Erik | given that the blue one had been in a frame damaging episode and the black one was ground hard by a kid who thinks subs are part of a performance car, mebbe I need to STOP buying these things used |
| 13:47.08 | ``Erik | no, it was just a curb bump |
| 13:47.15 | ``Erik | in your car, you woulda laughed and kept rolling |
| 13:47.37 | d-lo | Well, different machines for different purposes. |
| 13:48.03 | ``Erik | I'm gettin' old, man. the purpose is looking more and more like a point A to point B thing |
| 13:48.09 | d-lo | How bad is the insurence deductable going to be? |
| 13:48.14 | ``Erik | 1k |
| 13:48.25 | ``Erik | and my fault, so yet more premium |
| 13:48.25 | d-lo | is having a bad spelin day. |
| 13:48.40 | d-lo | well thats plain shitty. |
| 13:49.14 | ``Erik | I can eat it... the car is paid off and I have enough to run off and buy a reasonably nice car out of pocket, but *shrug* still sucks |
| 13:49.29 | d-lo | take a few years off and get a good ol reliable honda. |
| 13:49.33 | d-lo | :) |
| 13:49.51 | ``Erik | heh, I drove dumber in my old honda than I've done in any of the bmw's :) |
| 13:49.58 | d-lo | Do the damage is all cosmetic? |
| 13:50.00 | ``Erik | was a $300 crapper, and I tore the shit out of it |
| 13:50.09 | ``Erik | no, the front right wheel was shifted |
| 13:50.37 | ``Erik | apparently, I hate the front starboard wheel. A lot. |
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| 13:50.47 | ``Erik | that was the one I demolished in the blue one |
| 13:51.30 | d-lo | I think you need to start driving in the middle of the road. Keep those curbs equidistant ;) |
| 13:51.47 | ``Erik | yeah, y'know, folk around here don't appreciate that missoura style driving |
| 13:52.04 | archivist | just concentrate on driving! |
| 13:52.16 | ``Erik | backroads of the ozarks, people seriously drive in the middle and only move to the side when there's oncoming traffic |
| 13:52.37 | ``Erik | I was concentrating! I just went around the corner to buy a pizza :( the nose drifted out when it REALLY should not have |
| 13:53.01 | ``Erik | I mean, I stop, I turn right, the nose slides... wtf, it's a rear wheel vehicle, if I was being stupid, the ass woulda gave out |
| 13:53.04 | ``Erik | er |
| 13:53.06 | ``Erik | turn left |
| 13:53.11 | ``Erik | (across traffic) |
| 13:53.44 | d-lo | The only accident I have ever been in involved the steering column giving out.... so I know the drill :/ |
| 13:53.45 | ``Erik | starts wondering if some of the debris he collected was not his own and that's what he tagged and slid on O.o |
| 13:54.41 | d-lo | ....you could get a Tesla! |
| 13:55.04 | ``Erik | at the moment, I'm trying to figure out if it'd be more economically viable to buy a used car and sell it when I get my m back, or rent one |
| 13:55.05 | ``Erik | heh |
| 13:55.15 | ``Erik | tesla's are nice, but they have competition in their niche now :) |
| 13:55.38 | d-lo | Does your insurance cover rentals? |
| 13:55.47 | ``Erik | and I kinda like the comfort factor more than the go-kart factor :/ I'm old |
| 13:55.53 | ``Erik | no |
| 13:55.57 | d-lo | feck |
| 13:56.04 | ``Erik | supposedly, allstate has a discount agreement with enterprise |
| 13:56.07 | d-lo | and the BMW dealer doesn't have a loner? |
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| 13:56.10 | ``Erik | but I didn't pay for rental coverage |
| 13:56.37 | ``Erik | I'm sure they do, and they'd probably give me one and a handjob given how much money I've given them, but I'm waiting for the inspector to look over my car |
| 13:56.51 | d-lo | thats the way it always goes, isn't it.... |
| 13:57.04 | ``Erik | indeed |
| 13:57.18 | d-lo | inspector = insurance adjustor? |
| 13:57.21 | ``Erik | I need to push this lisp shit so'z I can get a positive cash flow and retire here :) never drive again heh |
| 13:57.34 | ``Erik | um, she called him an inspector, but I'm sure it's the same |
| 13:57.54 | ``Erik | job is to look over the vehicle and come up with an estimate and options on repair/replacement(iftotalled) |
| 13:59.05 | ``Erik | I'm hoping it's just a matter of some new a-frames, wheel, tire, air dam, fender, and some steering stuff |
| 13:59.27 | d-lo | ah, okay. inspector == adjustor. |
| 13:59.41 | d-lo | so, how did the Po-Po call it? |
| 13:59.59 | ``Erik | the sheriff figured that something in the steering probably broke |
| 13:59.59 | d-lo | Failure to control vehicle or something? |
| 14:00.04 | ``Erik | no ticket |
| 14:00.12 | d-lo | no fault! awesome. |
| 14:00.15 | ``Erik | gave me a ride home |
| 14:00.19 | d-lo | :) |
| 14:00.21 | ``Erik | insurance is saying it's all my fault, of course |
| 14:00.35 | d-lo | well, they have to bill someone :( |
| 14:00.42 | ``Erik | of course |
| 14:00.53 | d-lo | its not like those monthly payments you make actually mean anything... |
| 14:01.00 | ``Erik | doubt I'd have much of a court case, though |
| 14:01.16 | ``Erik | heh, dude, after the blue one, I'm so far ahead I just don't care |
| 14:01.55 | brlcad | or two! |
| 14:01.59 | d-lo | Well, if you work closely with the mechanics, you might be able to have them 'officially state' the failure. Could help keep your rates down. |
| 14:02.11 | ``Erik | perhaps |
| 14:02.15 | ``Erik | I intend to be involved |
| 14:02.25 | ``Erik | hey, brlcad, can I borrow your car for a bit? ;) |
| 14:02.35 | d-lo | brlcad: get to swim today? ;) |
| 14:02.38 | archivist | methinks NO |
| 14:02.45 | brlcad | d-lo: almost! |
| 14:02.52 | brlcad | guy right next to me did |
| 14:03.04 | ``Erik | swim? |
| 14:03.15 | ``Erik | oh, was this a rowwing morning? |
| 14:03.19 | ``Erik | rowing, even |
| 14:03.21 | archivist | fell in |
| 14:03.26 | brlcad | we were on the docks and I was pushing one of the eight-man boats away from the docks |
| 14:03.39 | brlcad | high winds, it was drifting back into the docks and towards our boat |
| 14:04.00 | brlcad | I slip slightly, but got my footing, then I hear *splash* |
| 14:04.09 | d-lo | doh! |
| 14:04.10 | brlcad | my bowman was in the water |
| 14:04.16 | ``Erik | do you wear surf shoes when you do that? |
| 14:04.31 | brlcad | no, there are shoes in the boat |
| 14:04.38 | ``Erik | (guy? as a bowman? I thought they were usually skinny chicks) |
| 14:04.53 | brlcad | so folks are usually in shoes or flip flops, and take them off to get strapped into the boat |
| 14:05.07 | ``Erik | s/are shoes/are no shoes/ ? |
| 14:05.29 | brlcad | 8-man boat, I was in "2 seat", so there's one buy behind me in "1 seat" aka "bow seat", also the "bow man" |
| 14:05.53 | ``Erik | wouldn't that be... a stern man? :D |
| 14:05.54 | brlcad | ``Erik: no, there ARE shoes attached to the boat |
| 14:05.59 | ``Erik | ohhhh |
| 14:06.03 | brlcad | no, they go backwards :) |
| 14:06.40 | ``Erik | ponders turtling when your shoes are bolted to the boat O.o |
| 14:06.54 | brlcad | anyways, basically a guy fell off the docks and into the water |
| 14:07.05 | brlcad | ice freaking cold, 10mph winds |
| 14:07.16 | brlcad | pretty funny, it happens |
| 14:07.36 | d-lo | ``Erik: Shoes glued to boat == incentive not to sink. Its a throw back to the viking days :) |
| 14:07.40 | ``Erik | was in a canoe that rolled in lagoon in mebbe 20f, UNfun |
| 14:07.46 | brlcad | d-lo: hehe, indeed |
| 14:08.08 | brlcad | they are all "quick release" velcro style in case the boat flips |
| 14:08.16 | ``Erik | upside down, wet, freezing... everything goes crazy |
| 14:08.45 | d-lo | 20 degree water will confuse pretty quick :) |
| 14:08.45 | brlcad | one of the things you get tested for in order to row alone, flipping the boat fully strapped in |
| 14:09.17 | ``Erik | assumed the boat was a simple aluminium monocoque structure, didn't think there'd be shoes glued in :) |
| 14:09.26 | d-lo | Hrm, is that a 'phobia? |
| 14:09.33 | brlcad | there's barely any metal on them boats |
| 14:09.37 | brlcad | that'd be insane |
| 14:09.41 | ``Erik | 20f air temp, I'm sure the water was a bit warmer |
| 14:09.44 | brlcad | and heavy |
| 14:09.59 | ``Erik | hm, all fiberglass now? |
| 14:10.04 | brlcad | they're all fibreglass/composites -- just the oar riggers are metal |
| 14:10.17 | ``Erik | pheers nanotube boats |
| 14:10.19 | brlcad | some older boats are thin wood (and insanely heavy) |
| 14:10.40 | ``Erik | aight, I d'no rowing :) canoes and day sailors |
| 14:10.52 | ``Erik | so I'm kinda assuming a lot of canoe traits |
| 14:10.53 | brlcad | they're like bicycles .. the price jacks up really fast to save just a couple pounds weight |
| 14:11.53 | d-lo | only knows boats with a sink/surface ratio == 1.0 ;) |
| 14:12.23 | ``Erik | I thought the person with the box facing 'the wrong way' was called the bowman? is that a... cockswain? |
| 14:12.23 | brlcad | yeah, not really the same construction at all -- most crew boats are so light that you're only allowed to step on just one part in the boat |
| 14:12.24 | brlcad | otherwise it's so thin, you can step right through it |
| 14:12.26 | ``Erik | <-- too weak to row, too fat to be a cockswain :) |
| 14:12.32 | brlcad | heh, coxswain |
| 14:12.44 | ``Erik | cock |
| 14:12.45 | ``Erik | swain |
| 14:13.02 | ``Erik | she's a cock swan, and you know it :> *duck* |
| 14:13.14 | ``Erik | sorry, I'll behave O:-) |
| 14:13.28 | brlcad | oh, most of them are shorty cuties (the girls at least) |
| 14:14.22 | d-lo | phears short girls who can beat most men at arm wrestling 8-| |
| 14:14.50 | ``Erik | coxswain doesn't row, they face the other way and give instructions |
| 14:14.52 | ``Erik | iirc |
| 14:15.00 | archivist | admits watching the ladies 8's in Cambridge UK entertaining |
| 14:15.30 | d-lo | new book: "How to beat a joke to death" by ``Erik . |
| 14:15.44 | starseeker | ``Erik: given your luck with cars, maybe we should get you a motorcycle :-) |
| 14:15.48 | ``Erik | oh... that was a joke? :> |
| 14:15.57 | ``Erik | trying to kill me off, cliff??? |
| 14:16.15 | d-lo | starseeker: I was thinking an uparmored MRAP vehicle. |
| 14:16.17 | archivist | you dont need help |
| 14:16.23 | ``Erik | was on the phone with my mom this morning, she said I needed a jeep, I told her I need a tonka truck |
| 14:16.34 | starseeker | ``Erik: In such a vehicle you would be compelled to drive carefully ;-) |
| 14:16.58 | d-lo | I can see ``Erik in a jeep. That fits. |
| 14:17.09 | starseeker | my grandparents have an old 70s caddy - good luck flipping that sucker |
| 14:17.18 | ``Erik | the nose drifted! it was effin' weird, the sheriff said that something probably broke as I was cornering! |
| 14:17.19 | d-lo | 33" mudders... 152 KC lamps on the double rollbar... |
| 14:17.42 | ``Erik | I mean, from a stop, across a left turn, in a rwd... the nose drifts |
| 14:17.43 | ``Erik | wtf? |
| 14:18.03 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:18.05 | starseeker | hmm - well, we could get you one of those racing cars that can blow apart and leave the driver intact |
| 14:18.16 | starseeker | brlcad: uh, oh - is he sick? |
| 14:18.20 | ``Erik | how's the dog doing? still trying to stick his nose in fire? |
| 14:18.27 | brlcad | starseeker: no, he's dying |
| 14:18.32 | starseeker | :-( |
| 14:18.33 | ``Erik | starseeker: that's what I have. |
| 14:18.37 | ``Erik | he's what, 17 now? |
| 14:18.42 | brlcad | he's just very old, conjestive heart failure |
| 14:18.47 | brlcad | yeah, 17 |
| 14:18.49 | starseeker | brlcad: sorry to hear that |
| 14:18.52 | d-lo | hell, that sucks. |
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| 14:19.04 | ``Erik | blind, deaf, .. a fighter |
| 14:19.04 | starseeker | remembers what it was like losing his dog when he was young |
| 14:19.05 | brlcad | most days are good, but last night wasn't one of them |
| 14:19.28 | brlcad | he's coming into a higher dosage of meds now, but need to keep an eye on him |
| 14:19.47 | starseeker | you don't find a better friend than a good dog |
| 14:20.05 | ``Erik | sure can smell out a piece of hotdog that fell, though heh :) |
| 14:20.06 | d-lo | brlcad: Are you going to let nature take its course or are you going to have him put down? |
| 14:20.22 | brlcad | d-lo: depends |
| 14:20.47 | starseeker | ``Erik: heh, no kidding. |
| 14:21.05 | brlcad | will let nature take it's course unless he's suffering for more than a day or two |
| 14:21.36 | starseeker | 's dog used to follow us around whenever we brought food out - figured out pretty quick that small kids dropped food a fairly high percentage of the time |
| 14:21.41 | d-lo | brlcad: we made the same choice when it came to Sandy's 15 y/o cat. |
| 14:21.59 | brlcad | he's only had two brief episodes where he's what I'd consider suffering, only to get better the next days (and stay better for a couple months afterwards) |
| 14:22.33 | d-lo | well thats good then. |
| 14:22.58 | ``Erik | at j-lo's bday a couple years ago, we went to the park off the road to the island, brlcad's dog kept trying to shove his face into the coals to get at grease drippings and bits of hotdogs and hamburgers :) |
| 14:23.11 | starseeker | ow |
| 14:23.22 | starseeker | j-lo? |
| 14:23.35 | ``Erik | wow, a couple years ago heh :( nettie was preggo iirc, and twingy's gf was visiting or something |
| 14:24.19 | starseeker | dogs are crazy for food even when they can see |
| 14:24.57 | ``Erik | googles for "dognip" |
| 14:25.05 | brlcad | he would have totally gone for that food even with his eyesight |
| 14:25.07 | ``Erik | huh, whuddya know, "meat" |
| 14:25.12 | starseeker | ours was given a piece of cake for his birthday once - he ate it in one gulp, realized what it was and proceeded to spend the next 10 minutes chasing the plate all over the yard licking at it |
| 14:25.20 | brlcad | and probably gotten it without getting hurt even, but didn't want to risk it with him blind |
| 14:25.57 | ``Erik | plus the issue of the grill burning the top of his head :( poor little guy |
| 14:26.37 | brlcad | barney lives to eat, the days he can't eat are the days I know he's not happy.. when there are fewer happy days than unhappy days, it'll be time |
| 14:27.17 | starseeker | nods |
| 14:27.34 | ``Erik | he's a good little guy, I'm glad I got to meet him :) |
| 14:28.06 | brlcad | starseeker: couple years ago I accidentally dropped an entire buffalo wing (drumstick) .. big one too .. barney snatched it up and swallowed it whole in about half a second |
| 14:28.18 | starseeker | hehe |
| 14:28.20 | ``Erik | wow, that musta hurt the next day |
| 14:28.20 | brlcad | I just blinked in disbelief, moment of panic, more disbelief |
| 14:28.33 | brlcad | nope, didn't even phase him |
| 14:28.48 | starseeker | has concluded that "gulp then taste" approach is common to most dogs |
| 14:29.03 | starseeker | at least, until they get fed an onion |
| 14:29.18 | ``Erik | hah |
| 14:29.24 | brlcad | thing is, he's a tiny dog .. I swear the drumstick was bigger than his mouth |
| 14:29.36 | starseeker | wow |
| 14:29.36 | brlcad | like a snake, detached that jaw and sucked it down |
| 14:29.37 | ``Erik | gf's son just decided he likes onion a lot, still trying to puzzle that one out |
| 14:30.06 | starseeker | has fought the good fight against onions for 20 years ;-) |
| 14:30.22 | starseeker | brlcad: impressive :-) that would have made a great video |
| 14:30.30 | ``Erik | I used to hate them, decided I love 'em... nice bulking item |
| 14:30.39 | ``Erik | heh, youtube ftw? O.o |
| 14:31.05 | starseeker | depending on the dog/drumstick size ratio, could have made america's funniest |
| 14:31.12 | ``Erik | he swallowed the bone? |
| 14:31.30 | d-lo | "Drumstick/Dog size ratio" ......lol |
| 14:31.47 | starseeker | new standard unit |
| 14:32.21 | starseeker | alrightie, time to stick the bills in the mail (ouch) |
| 14:32.21 | ``Erik | my car gets 32 kfc drumsticks to the poodle, and that's how I like it! |
| 14:32.22 | brlcad | ``Erik: he swallowed the drumstick thing whole, one swipe |
| 14:32.40 | brlcad | nice big breaded one from pats |
| 14:33.21 | starseeker | ``Erik: I wouldn't tell the SPCA you consider poodles a unit of distance ;-) |
| 14:33.22 | ``Erik | 'k, I'm not a chicken eater, it has chemical reprecussions... so'z help me out here, there was bone inside of what your dog swallowed? |
| 14:33.33 | ``Erik | unit of volume, starseeker, get it right |
| 14:33.50 | starseeker | well, from the standpoint of a car... |
| 14:36.29 | d-lo | I *think* the next Top Gear is the one where they are going to be road testing the Tesla and a bunch of other 'alternate' fuel cars... i really wanna see that one. |
| 14:37.11 | ``Erik | would rather just work from home and have the needed stores be walking distance :( |
| 14:37.39 | brlcad | ``Erik: yes, a pretty big one |
| 14:37.58 | ``Erik | brlcad: and he... didn't have issue passing it? O.O |
| 14:38.25 | d-lo | ``Erik: would like to see a nation wide system of pneumatic tubes. Even if they only moved things and not people. *THOOMP* "Honey! Pizza's here!" |
| 14:38.28 | ``Erik | I'm thinkin' something mebbe 15 cm long |
| 14:38.33 | ``Erik | 10-15 |
| 14:38.49 | ``Erik | *thoomp* wait, suicide booth? BITE MY SHINEY METAL ASS |
| 14:38.53 | d-lo | lol |
| 14:39.19 | _sushi_ | lol |
| 14:39.29 | _sushi_ | I have a pneumatic tube on my bicycle |
| 14:39.33 | _sushi_ | Makes a smooth ride |
| 14:40.11 | ``Erik | dave, I think I have my lithp distance calculator working correctly, I need to test it out some... if it works, then I can do a pretty simple a* style 'best path' solver |
| 14:40.23 | d-lo | lithp? haha |
| 14:40.39 | ``Erik | lithp, yeth. yethterdayth flight gave me thome coding time |
| 14:40.40 | d-lo | Sexy! |
| 14:41.18 | ``Erik | once I have teh fng data in, I'm thinking the appropriate algo is to: |
| 14:41.48 | ``Erik | take the subset of jg's higher than current. For each, solve which is the shortest time to terminal desination. |
| 14:42.08 | ``Erik | Given the best single move, repeat. |
| 14:42.57 | ``Erik | reasonable? |
| 14:43.05 | d-lo | Hrm, whats the problem you are trying to solve? I don't see it. |
| 14:43.26 | ``Erik | um, I have a fleet at alpha, I want to get to beta... what's the fastest I can get there? |
| 14:43.33 | ``Erik | give me the convoluted path |
| 14:43.39 | brlcad | ``Erik: sorta like these: (but a lil bigger) http://www.ironhorsepa.com/wings.jpg |
| 14:44.04 | ``Erik | there's nothing in that image to confer size |
| 14:44.10 | brlcad | no trouble passing it at all (he's used to eating tons of wierd stuff -- he used to eat almost whatever I ate) |
| 14:44.26 | ``Erik | scale, rather |
| 14:44.53 | d-lo | okay got it. How does the logic handle if yoru fleet isn't on a FNG controlled planet? or a planet without a JG? |
| 14:45.23 | d-lo | brlcad: damn it, now I am hungry. |
| 14:45.28 | ``Erik | d-lo: say I have fleet in a sector on no jg, there's a l2 jg in the secor, there's an l9 jg in the region, I want to go to a new galaxy... I assume my algo will tell me to jump to the l2, then jump to the l9, then jump to the target |
| 14:45.47 | ``Erik | 0 is a valid number, I'm not roman. |
| 14:46.04 | brlcad | d-lo: me too! |
| 14:46.20 | d-lo | ``Erik: okay, cool. Then yes, sounds reasonable. |
| 14:46.21 | ``Erik | *sob* and I ain't got no car to meet up |
| 14:46.43 | d-lo | The 'distance' logic in AE is rather stupid if I remember correctly. |
| 14:46.46 | ``Erik | I'm fighting the urge to over-engineer and bring up guild-hopping, though I'd like it |
| 14:46.52 | d-lo | ``Erik: I'll fly if you buy :) |
| 14:46.57 | ``Erik | stupid stupid, not stupid easy |
| 14:47.04 | ``Erik | I'm ~45 minutes from post |
| 14:47.28 | d-lo | eh, its monday. quiet as death around here. |
| 14:47.41 | ``Erik | there're 3 distinct computation paths for intergalactic distance |
| 14:47.46 | ``Erik | it's fugly |
| 14:48.05 | d-lo | i remember finding an image that showed the basics of 'distance' |
| 14:48.13 | d-lo | I personally thought it was stupid |
| 14:48.16 | ``Erik | I think I pasted tat pentagram around |
| 14:48.51 | ``Erik | it's what made me look for a x5, so I could maximize my trade partners |
| 14:50.05 | ``Erik | if'n someone wants to cruise by to pick me up and head to something like duclaws or la tolteca or soemthing, I'll buy their lunch... it's a trip, though |
| 14:50.13 | ``Erik | so'z I don't expect any takers :) |
| 14:50.43 | d-lo | I hven't seen any coordination here for lunch... yet. |
| 14:51.51 | ``Erik | if I'm gonna be involved, coordination has to be, like, now. :) it's all cool, I mean, I'm too far away |
| 14:52.06 | brlcad | folks interested in being a mentor should log in at http://socghop.appspot.com and request it |
| 14:52.10 | ``Erik | ain't no hard feelings if ya'll don't go through fruity hoops and drive way out of your way |
| 14:52.38 | ``Erik | I'm listed as admin on that, does that mean I'm not a regular mentor? |
| 14:52.47 | brlcad | ``Erik, d-lo, starseeker, yukonbob come to mind for starters |
| 14:53.09 | brlcad | ``Erik: being an admin is separate from being a mentor |
| 14:53.28 | ``Erik | I can take a student if needed, or I can just sit back and help questions... I think I'll pass on the summit, though, ok? |
| 14:53.36 | brlcad | sure |
| 14:53.47 | brlcad | nice to send new folks each year anyways |
| 14:53.56 | ``Erik | that's what I was thinking |
| 14:54.13 | ``Erik | <-- felt awful out of place last year :/ |
| 14:54.28 | brlcad | plus you'd get to avoid chicago and large bottles of vodka :) |
| 14:54.40 | ``Erik | well, chicago, mebbe |
| 14:54.47 | ``Erik | though it's not that bad of a spot |
| 14:55.03 | brlcad | you weren't exactly happy-go-lucky in the airport |
| 14:55.04 | ``Erik | I just spent time in layover in minneapolis and charlotsville |
| 14:55.19 | ``Erik | I hate flying. I hate what 9/11 has turned flying into. |
| 14:55.34 | brlcad | suspects you haded flying before security changes |
| 14:55.39 | brlcad | hated even too |
| 14:55.41 | ``Erik | no, I used to love it |
| 14:55.46 | ``Erik | especially small planes |
| 14:55.59 | brlcad | well, outside of missouri, large international airports |
| 14:56.03 | ``Erik | I want to get my private v license, mebbe a sports license |
| 14:56.04 | brlcad | lots of peeps on the move |
| 14:56.49 | ``Erik | I dislike crowds, and I dislike the strip search "everyone's a criminal until proven otherwise" approach to airport security |
| 14:57.35 | ``Erik | but I love the feeling of a small twin turboprop wiggling up into the air |
| 14:59.19 | ``Erik | (didn't help that I was desperate for a piss when ya got pulled over) |
| 15:00.22 | d-lo | I am not a big fan of small aircraft's ability to rapidly drop in altitude and make your complimentry Coke hover 8" off your tray table. |
| 15:00.34 | d-lo | It tests my faith in engineering a bit. |
| 15:00.51 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03137.71.226.54 07http://brlcad.org * r1289 10/wiki/Documentation: test |
| 15:01.07 | ``Erik | haven't had that episode yet, but, zomfg, I want to! |
| 15:01.46 | ``Erik | and damn well engineered aircraft can sustain -8 g's... so, uh, the engineering is there, dude |
| 15:01.51 | ``Erik | the pilot may not be, but ... |
| 15:01.59 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03137.71.226.54 07http://brlcad.org * r1290 10/wiki/Documentation: Undo revision 1289 by [[Special:Contributions/137.71.226.54|137.71.226.54]] ([[User talk:137.71.226.54|Talk]]) |
| 15:01.59 | d-lo | small twin turbo out or Albany, NY to Cinncinati. Hit some weather blowing off the great lakes.... unfun. |
| 15:02.54 | ``Erik | I'd like to get a vfr commutor and sport license as some point in my life |
| 15:03.12 | ``Erik | with a seaplane label, if I can |
| 15:03.15 | d-lo | just because the Engineers planned something on paper/computer bears nothing on how its put together on the assembly line nor on the underpaid,slackass maintainers/mechanics :) |
| 15:03.23 | ``Erik | well |
| 15:03.34 | ``Erik | the weather and the pilot had issues... it was bad |
| 15:03.44 | ``Erik | did the wings come off of the plane? no? then the engineers were good |
| 15:04.09 | d-lo | Heh, you would make a horrible Nuke :P |
| 15:04.22 | ``Erik | if your drinks are at 0g in a sustained bit due to such a conflict, I'd imagine the engineers did good |
| 15:04.23 | ``Erik | :) |
| 15:05.09 | ``Erik | yeah, ya nukes are all pansies |
| 15:05.25 | d-lo | Mushrooms, we are all *Mushrooms* |
| 15:05.29 | d-lo | there is a difference. |
| 15:05.36 | ``Erik | "omg, I dropped this 20 pound wrench on my toe when I was barefoot, even though the sign says wear stealtoes... qq, ) |
| 15:05.47 | d-lo | lol |
| 15:06.09 | d-lo | thats 'Darwinism in Action' right there. |
| 15:07.07 | ``Erik | I wouldn't wanna be a nuke, I know I fuck up, I fuck up a lot... in code, I catch MOST of those... but before people die, someone else gets a fair shot at what I did |
| 15:07.16 | ``Erik | and, y'know, if I fuck up, tell me ! I love it, it makes me better. |
| 15:08.33 | d-lo | Nah, I only said that because of your Engineering Atttitude :) I will refine that statement and say that you would make a great Nuke Electrician, but not a good Nuke Electronics Tech or Mechanic :) |
| 15:08.46 | d-lo | Wire-biters get away with a lot :) |
| 15:08.53 | ``Erik | I'd never want to be a dike wrangler. |
| 15:09.26 | d-lo | lol, thats a new one. |
| 15:09.39 | ``Erik | I don't like people getting dead, I want as many folk between me and them as possible |
| 15:12.05 | ``Erik | so help me out here, you stated 3 or so MOS's, which is which? |
| 15:14.05 | d-lo | Not MOS's, ratings:) |
| 15:14.42 | d-lo | Nukes are MM's, EM's, and ET's: Machinist Mate, Electrician Mate, and Electronics Technicians. |
| 15:14.59 | ``Erik | rating like E-X ? |
| 15:15.19 | d-lo | -or- Knuckle Draggers, Wire-biters, and Twigets. |
| 15:15.38 | d-lo | i dont understand 'e-x'... |
| 15:15.56 | ``Erik | oh, e3 e5 e8... |
| 15:16.01 | ``Erik | all bow down, it's an e9 |
| 15:16.07 | ``Erik | bwahahhaha, basic, an e1 |
| 15:16.15 | d-lo | thats rank, not to be confused with rate |
| 15:16.56 | d-lo | rate = job, rank = position in food chain. |
| 15:17.14 | ``Erik | ahh |
| 15:17.43 | ``Erik | so help me out here, what's the laymans vew of mm em et |
| 15:18.06 | ``Erik | and, uh, ne |
| 15:18.52 | d-lo | EM = Electricians. Handle mainline power, generators, converters, blah blah, blah... basiclally any electronics/electrical not directly reactor related. |
| 15:19.09 | d-lo | ET = Electronics Techs. Handle the solid state Reactor Protection junk. |
| 15:19.22 | d-lo | ET = low voltage wimps. |
| 15:19.46 | d-lo | MM = Mechanics. Pipes, steam, oil systems, cooling systems, etc. |
| 15:20.24 | d-lo | and then the sub group of MM's called ELTs (Engineeing Lab Techs) who do all the water and radio chemistry. |
| 15:20.55 | _sushi_ | d-lo: are you sure youre not divulging any army secrets? |
| 15:20.59 | d-lo | Throw in an o-ganger to keep us dirty enlisted from taking over the engineroom and voila, you have EngDiv of a sub. |
| 15:21.05 | ``Erik | in your parlance, I woulda probably gone towards et before I decided to say "fuck all ya'll" to the military :) |
| 15:21.18 | ``Erik | still not sure what "nuke electrician" qualifies as :) |
| 15:21.33 | d-lo | _sushi_: Army? nope. This is all Navy :) and its not secret in any way. Just ask Google. |
| 15:21.39 | d-lo | EM |
| 15:21.39 | ``Erik | karel: 'sall navy, and I'm sure it's all in wikipedia |
| 15:22.18 | d-lo | EM = Electrician's Mate (rate) |
| 15:23.08 | ``Erik | shittiest $1017 pizza ever. |
| 15:23.21 | d-lo | ranks: (from E1 to E9): SR EMFA, EMFN, EM3, EM2, EM1, EMC, EMCS, EMCM |
| 15:23.51 | d-lo | :/ I can imagine. |
| 15:25.07 | ``Erik | I have to go get rich so I can make someone else drive me |
| 15:25.07 | ``Erik | did enough jrotc to come in as e3, but is too old now |
| 15:25.14 | ``Erik | also; I d'no if I want my title to be "semen" |
| 15:25.36 | d-lo | Electricians are Firemen :) |
| 15:25.43 | d-lo | hoooya! |
| 15:25.57 | ``Erik | does that mean ya'll start fires? ;) |
| 15:26.15 | d-lo | Aquitted. No Proof. |
| 15:26.41 | ``Erik | SO |
| 15:26.45 | ``Erik | I had a brainfart the other day |
| 15:26.45 | d-lo | Butyes, I have been party to a 27,000V fire :/ |
| 15:26.58 | ``Erik | on transportation between solar systems |
| 15:27.10 | ``Erik | got time to talk shit? |
| 15:27.13 | d-lo | Transformer varnish stinks when it melts :( |
| 15:27.18 | d-lo | sure. |
| 15:27.18 | ``Erik | oh hell yeah |
| 15:27.37 | ``Erik | fucking transformers are the stinkiest components around until you overload a dielectric capacitor |
| 15:28.12 | d-lo | I have only seen one of them big oil filled caps blow. that was just messy, not stinky. |
| 15:28.19 | ``Erik | here's my thought, every ss is connect to another by a brane, some solar systems have multible branes, each starting ss has a single brain |
| 15:28.27 | d-lo | so, brainfart = good or bad? |
| 15:28.59 | d-lo | hold on. this brainstorming for a new game concept? |
| 15:29.14 | ``Erik | branes are randmonly linked between planets, so even if you have the physical location of a planet, you may not have the shortest path to it |
| 15:29.19 | ``Erik | ae knockoff |
| 15:29.25 | d-lo | kk, onboard now. |
| 15:29.52 | d-lo | okay, a game I am stealing conepts from calls branes 'Starlanes' |
| 15:29.57 | d-lo | so I gotcha |
| 15:30.03 | ``Erik | it's an old string theory idea |
| 15:30.37 | ``Erik | but the notion is that solar systems are connected by subspace rifts that can be ridden |
| 15:30.56 | ``Erik | physical locality is seperate from "hyperspace" locality |
| 15:31.40 | ``Erik | players start in fairly isolated areas and access the big mess later in their career |
| 15:32.06 | d-lo | big mess = the rest of the super vast universe? |
| 15:32.20 | ``Erik | and there's no easy way to know how long ti takes to get to a target given just its coordinates |
| 15:32.23 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 15:32.56 | d-lo | check this link: |
| 15:32.59 | d-lo | http://www2.worldvillage.com/wv/gamezone/images/screens/asc1.jpg |
| 15:33.21 | ``Erik | ok, what'm I looking at? |
| 15:33.30 | d-lo | game is called acendancy. the dots on the screen are solar systems and the lines represent the only travelable paths between systems. |
| 15:33.58 | d-lo | its also a 2D screenshot of a 3D universe, so its slightly flattened. |
| 15:33.58 | ``Erik | sounds about right |
| 15:34.10 | ``Erik | it's not a new concept, just one I haven't seen much |
| 15:34.22 | d-lo | Personnally, I love the idea. |
| 15:34.33 | ``Erik | I'm trying to put the playability into aspect here :) |
| 15:34.39 | d-lo | puts some 'geographical' stragedy back into the game. |
| 15:34.59 | d-lo | 'Take this system and we can lock down this whole sector..." |
| 15:35.02 | ``Erik | also reduces guild-centric stuff a bit |
| 15:35.24 | ``Erik | this wussy is no longer "just right there", but down this twisted narrow unmapped path |
| 15:35.57 | d-lo | Ascendancy is Abandonware, you sould grab a DL and check some of the ascpects of game play. they have some wicked ideas. |
| 15:36.00 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@202.3.77.38) | |
| 15:36.19 | hippieindamakin8 | hey madant_ |
| 15:36.23 | ``Erik | ah, abandonia for the win |
| 15:36.55 | madant_ | hey hippieindamakin8 , just about steeping out.. how's the proposal coming along |
| 15:36.58 | ``Erik | I'll have to grab a dos emulator |
| 15:36.58 | d-lo | right on. |
| 15:37.22 | hippieindamakin8 | madant_, working on it :| |
| 15:37.22 | d-lo | DosBox makes it super easy. Ascendancy runs 'out of the box' i think. |
| 15:39.23 | hippieindamakin8 | madant_, got 3 term papers this week :| one on "geometric approximation via coresets","curve fitting of unorganized data points" and "NOx emmisions" |
| 15:39.30 | hippieindamakin8 | *due this week |
| 16:52.54 | starseeker | brlcad: thinking about a "material object" as distinct from a "geometry object" in the database - would it be desirable to store all material objects by default in a hidden _materials toplevel combination or some such? |
| 16:52.55 | starseeker | or maybe just not list them by default with ls? |
| 16:55.53 | starseeker | also, would we want to define a default structure for such objects that stores certain "standard" info, or just use an attribute system to attach attributes to the material object? |
| 16:57.01 | starseeker | 's inclination would be to at least have density and shader settings as default information |
| 17:17.56 | *** join/#brlcad dreeves (n=c752f34a@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 17:50.40 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r34062 10/brlcad/trunk/db/goliath.asc: Add source attribute to goliath model. |
| 17:53.48 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@202.3.77.38) | |
| 18:15.34 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r34063 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 18:15.34 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: Switch brlman from a wrapper invoking awf to a wrapper invoking the system man |
| 18:15.34 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: command. awf is not able to correctly handle output generated by the new |
| 18:15.34 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: docbook man page generation process. The brlman shortcut is preserved for those |
| 18:15.34 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: not wishing to manually specify the path to the BRL-CAD man pages. awf |
| 18:15.36 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: originally was intended to supply man page reading functionality on systems |
| 18:15.38 | CIA-40 | BRL-CAD: without their own man command, but nowadays the only major environment without a |
| 18:43.33 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (i=erik@c-76-111-12-116.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 19:02.32 | *** join/#brlcad dreeves (n=IceChat7@67.130.253.14) | |
| 19:03.25 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik__ (i=erik@c-76-111-12-116.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 19:09.05 | brlcad | starseeker: .g files already have object categorization for geometric and non-geometric |
| 19:11.05 | brlcad | major type 3 is particularly relevant and would probably be what to use |
| 19:13.35 | brlcad | got a build failure after 34063 |
| 19:23.36 | starseeker | hmm |
| 19:23.38 | starseeker | rebuilds |
| 19:24.02 | starseeker | ah |
| 19:24.04 | starseeker | sorry |
| 19:27.19 | starseeker | prods CIA |
| 19:29.13 | starseeker | brlcad: should be fixed now |
| 19:33.22 | starseeker | brlcad: you're referring to DB5_MAJORTYPE_ATTRIBUTE_ONLY in db5.h? |
| 19:36.13 | brlcad | well yeah, that's the low-level implementation detail |
| 19:36.40 | brlcad | you can read about it a little bit on the v5 spec document, http://brlcad.org/OLD/newdb/newdb.html |
| 19:41.38 | brlcad | rationale and organizational layout from there is good |
| 19:43.41 | starseeker | can minor types be assigned to this type of major type as well? |
| 19:44.42 | brlcad | all objects have a major+minor |
| 19:52.32 | brlcad | right now, all DB5_MAJORTYPE_ATTRIBUTE_ONLY objects are minor type 0 |
| 19:59.23 | *** join/#brlcad _sushi_ (n=_sushi_@77-58-245-4.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:07.14 | starseeker | suggests creating a minor type for material objects |
| 20:26.20 | brlcad | probably a good idea |
| 20:27.12 | brlcad | but that'd also imply a different structure to the underlying private data |
| 20:27.26 | brlcad | which may or may not be the case, depends on the implementation |
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| 21:45.24 | brlcad | cheers for progress |
| 22:30.05 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik___ (i=erik@c-76-111-12-116.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 22:42.24 | starseeker | sees two types of data that it would make immediate sense to associate with a material object. One is (obviously) the density, and the other is shader properties |
| 22:43.00 | starseeker | shader properties might be either directly stored in the material object, or might be created as a "shader object" which is then pointed to by the material object |
| 22:43.58 | starseeker | I'm not sure of the relative merits, offhand |
| 22:45.55 | starseeker | there would be a (very slight) space savings for cases where no shader settings are defined or two materials share the same shader settings if shader objects were used, but unless there is some other use for shader objects the extra abstraction might just clutter up the database with 2x the needed object names |
| 22:46.27 | starseeker | in the case where all materials DO have their own shaders |
| 22:47.10 | brlcad | shaders would actually be another potential object type |
| 22:47.20 | starseeker | right |
| 22:47.26 | brlcad | where a given material references some shader object(s) |
| 22:47.39 | starseeker | is it worth the extra abstraction? |
| 22:47.47 | brlcad | the point, though, with regards to the minor type is how it is actually stored |
| 22:47.50 | brlcad | the bits in the record |
| 22:48.22 | starseeker | hmm. |
| 22:48.26 | brlcad | since you could conceivably implement the whole thing as-is and handle it just as transparently at the api level |
| 22:48.32 | brlcad | or app level even |
| 22:48.46 | brlcad | as that is domain-specific (which is exactly what the attributes were designed to support) |
| 22:49.32 | starseeker | nods - I had been assuming what makes the material object interesting is the density being an "attribute on an attribute", so to speak |
| 22:50.42 | starseeker | we could of course stuff the info into material_name and material_density attributes on regions |
| 22:51.42 | brlcad | right |
| 22:51.54 | brlcad | then it's just an issue of data replication and verification |
| 22:52.17 | brlcad | i'm leaning towards just doing exactly like what we do with combinations |
| 22:52.22 | brlcad | everything is a named reference |
| 22:53.34 | starseeker | I'm not following - what are you referencing for material info? |
| 22:53.41 | brlcad | so there would still be a material id attribute of sorts, but instead of being GIFTmater=4, it would become something like material="steel", and there would be an attribute/material object named 'steel' with the information for that material |
| 22:53.55 | starseeker | ah |
| 22:54.20 | starseeker | likes the idea of there being one material object named "steel" per db |
| 22:54.31 | brlcad | the combination reference is if I have a combination that is u sph1 u sph2, those are named references that imply there are (or should be) objects named sph1 and sph2 |
| 22:54.41 | starseeker | right |
| 22:54.58 | starseeker | so a material attribute implies there should be a steel material object |
| 22:55.07 | brlcad | if they're just treated as objects, then databases can be merged together and the same logic we use now for name collisions applies |
| 22:55.15 | starseeker | nods |
| 22:55.18 | brlcad | right |
| 22:55.22 | starseeker | I like it |
| 22:55.49 | starseeker | that also avoids two regions claiming to be steel but with differrent material_density attributes, since they're both referencing the same steel material object |
| 22:55.56 | brlcad | then if down the road we wanted to assign textures or shaders, that would maybe be a similarly assigned attribute |
| 22:56.02 | brlcad | (on the material object) |
| 22:56.12 | starseeker | nice |
| 22:56.27 | starseeker | starting to "feel" like a BRL-CAD-esque solution |
| 22:57.09 | brlcad | I believe in the original material design we worked on a few years back, there was even a way to base one material off of an existing material, giving hierarchical properties |
| 22:57.22 | brlcad | something to think about again if it gets a proper object |
| 22:57.47 | starseeker | 's current thought on shaders is to expand the densities parsing to (optionally) handle shader settings - when a material object is created from a densities file, it could optionally generate the shader object if supplied (and not already found in the database) |
| 22:58.24 | starseeker | brlcad: hmm. what material properties would you want to inherit? a density defined as a function of another density? |
| 22:59.21 | brlcad | on an only somewhat related side note, I think shader objects are a fantastic direction to go in |
| 22:59.32 | brlcad | instead of the shader string presently used |
| 22:59.50 | starseeker | whole-heartedly agrees |
| 22:59.51 | brlcad | a lot more complicated though |
| 23:02.42 | brlcad | starseeker: basically it's like classes or scopes -- answering your inheritance question -- there are a set of parameters for a given material like it's density, modulus, strength, shearing factors, shader properties, etc |
| 23:03.22 | starseeker | what are you seeing as the major complications with shader objects? |
| 23:03.30 | starseeker | ah, got it |
| 23:03.32 | brlcad | there are very often materials used that are just slight tweaks of other materials -- a variant of "steel" that is "hardened steel #83" that has all the same properties as the prevoius 82 but this one has a slightly different density |
| 23:04.46 | brlcad | material properties are fairly fixed (e.g., minimally just need a name and a density) -- there are a set of attributes that can be itemized |
| 23:05.12 | brlcad | shaders, though, are a little more dynamic, are wildly different from shader to shader |
| 23:06.19 | brlcad | just would have to be careful to implement a shader object so that the serialized guts aren't going to limit "upgrades" |
| 23:07.07 | brlcad | I can add a new parameter to the pervasive phong shader now and it won't hose anything or require the latest version to work, if it was tied to a db object and binary parsing, that becomes something we'd have to pay attention to |
| 23:12.05 | starseeker | hmm |
| 23:12.41 | *** join/#brlcad BigAToo (n=BigAToo@pool-96-230-124-59.sbndin.btas.verizon.net) | |
| 23:42.52 | ``Erik | wonders how embedded parms would interact with other rendering methods (edge, photon mapping, radar analysis, etc) |
