IRC log for #brlcad on 20090629

01:52.31 *** join/#brlcad BigAToo (n=BigAToo@pool-96-230-124-196.sbndin.btas.verizon.net)
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08:51.36 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03Ralith 07http://brlcad.org * r1514 10/wiki/User:Ralith: Log for 2009-06-28
09:42.12 *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1096600584.dsl.bell.ca)
11:14.14 d-lo merinin all!
11:17.53 d-lo Ralith: How goes the conflict resolution?
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11:37.41 *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14FD98.dip.t-dialin.net)
13:11.28 *** join/#brlcad elena (n=elena@89.136.118.141)
13:13.31 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03ebautu * r34893 10/web/trunk/htdocs/more/sites/all/modules/brlcad/ (. brlcad.info brlcad.install brlcad.module): BRL-CAD integration module (initial commit)
13:44.22 brlcad hi elena!
13:44.27 brlcad welcome back
13:44.29 elena hi.
13:44.32 elena thank you.
13:44.40 brlcad have a good trip?
13:44.44 elena yes.
13:44.55 elena I was just about to ask some help here :)
13:45.02 elena but first, how are you?
13:52.05 brlcad i'm doing great, had a fantastic weekend
13:52.28 elena wonderfull. I'm glad to hear that.
13:52.45 brlcad wonderful wine tasting event and dinner with friends on saturday, latino festival on sunday :)
13:53.03 elena that sounds very nice.
13:53.24 elena what kind of festival?
13:53.42 elena I mean: dancing, food, etc?
13:53.45 brlcad yeah
13:53.56 elena ok.
13:54.14 brlcad concerts going, lots of great food, music, dancing
13:54.40 brlcad the wine tasting was aboslutely spectacular, a real highlight
13:54.41 elena in your town or traveling?
13:54.54 brlcad in baltimore
13:56.27 elena do you have time to give me some tips on raytraceing models?
13:57.46 brlcad sure, is this for generating pictures?
13:58.02 elena yes.
13:58.25 elena I'm not sure if I should use mged and the rt command
13:58.35 brlcad that's probably the best way
13:58.36 elena or only the rt tool.
13:58.48 elena ok. then I know how to do it.
13:58.55 brlcad running through mged will make it a little easier to set up the view
13:59.03 elena yes. exactly.
13:59.09 elena another problem.
13:59.59 elena is there a way to setup the view size so that it best fits the model?
14:00.09 brlcad heh
14:00.14 brlcad was just going to comment on that
14:00.16 brlcad yes and no
14:00.24 brlcad the 'autoview' command fits the model to the view
14:00.33 brlcad but it does a guarantee fit, not necessarily a best fit
14:00.43 elena that's ok.
14:00.50 brlcad you'll probably want to run "zoom 2" on everything being rendered
14:00.51 elena i didn't know about autoview.
14:01.05 elena ok. i'll do some tests.
14:01.17 brlcad if there is nothing displayed, and you 'draw'/'e' something up, it'll autoview automatically
14:01.26 elena i tried some hacks with grouping objects. not very successful.
14:02.13 elena and I was thinking to do something like:
14:02.16 elena draw *
14:02.20 brlcad oh, no
14:02.23 elena rt -o model.pix
14:02.24 brlcad don't do that :)
14:02.28 elena why?
14:02.37 brlcad "draw *" is very bad
14:02.39 elena and what's the alternative.
14:02.47 elena ?
14:03.08 brlcad that means draw every single object and shape in the database
14:03.09 elena because it draws all objects?
14:03.20 elena yes.
14:03.29 elena what's the alternative?
14:03.52 elena so I have a database that the user uploaded.
14:04.09 elena and I want to get the images from different angles.
14:04.22 brlcad so if the objects were text, and a word is a union of the letters, and a phrase is a grouping of multiple words, like "Hello world"
14:04.31 elena I'll use ae to set the angle, autoview to fit the object.
14:05.06 elena go on...
14:05.28 brlcad saying "draw *" is effectively, "draw H", "draw e", "draw l", "draw l", "draw o", "draw ' '", "draw Hello", "draw world", "draw Hello world"
14:06.05 brlcad it's everything including all uses and groupings .. not what you want, you want just the last one "draw Hello world"
14:07.00 brlcad moreover with brl-cad geometries, our format supports an arbitrary number of models per file, so there could be lots of 'main' objects, not necessarily just one
14:07.18 brlcad to find a starting point, you run the "tops" command
14:07.22 brlcad that lists the top-level objects
14:07.41 brlcad normally, one or more of those is a primary
14:07.57 elena and draw that.
14:08.01 elena ok. makes sence.
14:08.01 brlcad right
14:08.22 elena can I do draw and tops in one command?
14:08.33 elena something like draw `tops` ?
14:08.40 brlcad you can, but you also don't want that
14:08.45 elena i think I can. I'll look.
14:08.49 brlcad that would imply they had something to do with each other
14:08.52 elena no? why?
14:09.02 brlcad they're top-level because they are independent
14:09.05 elena you're reading my thoughts before I type :)
14:09.21 brlcad .g files are collections of trees of geometries.
14:09.35 brlcad there may be one tree, there may be twenty trees
14:09.48 elena how would you approach this?
14:09.48 brlcad you've seen the example .g files, yes?
14:09.53 elena yes.
14:10.17 brlcad I could very trivially combine them all into one single .g file and it would be perfectly valid
14:10.34 brlcad there'd just be a lot of top-level objects
14:10.52 elena that will alter the db, too, right?
14:11.01 brlcad what do you mean?
14:12.01 brlcad i mean those 20+ separate files are only separated by convention, I could combine them together and it's a valid .g
14:12.13 elena in mged. if I do a group.
14:12.30 elena that group will instantly be saved in the database.
14:12.34 brlcad i mean literally, you can "cat *.g > everything.g" .. bad thing to do, but entirley valid
14:12.51 elena I didn't know that.
14:13.05 brlcad creating a group in mged is a different thing altogether -- that basically creates a new top-level object
14:13.13 brlcad and if the things you're grouping were top-level, they no longer are
14:13.50 brlcad it's a set of directed acyclic graphs, with named references
14:14.04 elena but in our case, the user will upload only one file.
14:14.22 brlcad one _file_ .. but that file could be anything
14:14.34 elena cool. let me play some more with what you told me and I'll get back.
14:14.43 *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@165.Red-81-35-69.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net)
14:14.44 brlcad so you're going to have to either just import all top-level objects
14:14.52 elena i'll buzz you or cliff some more if I don't manage it myself.
14:14.54 brlcad or have the user specify which object to import
14:15.28 brlcad you definitely should not be creating groups or geometry
14:15.43 elena yes. I imagine that.
14:16.03 elena this is why I was looking for the autoview-style solution also.
14:16.19 brlcad for safety, you may even want to store the files as read-only, 444 or something
14:16.43 elena i'll look into that, too.
14:17.18 elena i think i lost some time trying to make a lot of customizations that proved not that important.
14:17.33 elena on the processing queue part.
14:17.57 elena but they led to a simpler solution :)
14:18.01 brlcad here's a good example, if you look at the havoc.g example file .. and run tops
14:18.07 brlcad you'll see there are three top-level objects
14:18.16 brlcad BRL-GSI_EFFORT/ havoc/ sun/R
14:18.45 brlcad you don't know which of those is important without asking the user
14:19.03 brlcad so you either import all three, or have the user prompt (in this case, havoc is the important one)
14:19.28 brlcad prompting is probably best as the important object is often not even a top-level
14:19.48 elena but if i have a different format
14:19.51 brlcad the m35.g file is another good example
14:20.09 elena then that might not have objects in it.
14:20.14 brlcad 8 top-level objects: 2 assemblies, 2 primitives, 4 regions
14:20.41 brlcad all formats have at least one object in them :)
14:21.02 brlcad it's just many are actually contrained to exactly one object,
14:21.16 elena what is _GLOBAL?
14:21.19 brlcad like the stl file format, one object
14:21.24 brlcad it's a non-geometric object
14:21.30 brlcad file attributes
14:21.40 elena aha.
14:21.44 brlcad stores things like title and the working units
14:21.52 elena ok. thank you for your help.
14:23.21 brlcad no problemo, keep the questions coming
14:23.57 elena :)
14:34.21 mafm hi
14:34.54 elena hi
14:36.35 brlcad hi
14:47.14 *** join/#brlcad Ralith_ (n=ralith@216.162.199.202)
14:47.24 starseeker hey elena
14:47.39 elena hi starseeker.
14:47.46 d-lo hi!
14:47.52 starseeker welcome back :-)
14:47.57 elena thank you :)
14:48.13 elena how have you been?
14:48.26 elena hi d-lo.
14:51.48 d-lo WIth all this greeting action happening, I just had to get in on it.
14:51.58 starseeker would actually recommend requiring the user to specify at least one named "primary" db object, or example, or something like that
14:52.02 elena :))
14:53.33 starseeker or, since user laziness usually wins, grab the tops list, generate some default raytraces, and present them a list of images asking them to select the correct toplevel images
14:53.40 elena will that work with other formats, too?
14:53.51 starseeker hard to say
14:54.28 brlcad that'll for for most all formats simply because we're a superset format
14:54.30 starseeker logically speaking, the first thing to check is whether there is a toplevel object named <filename> if the file is called filename.g
14:54.44 elena what would be the purpose of creating a top object if you don't use it in the final render?
14:54.46 starseeker (e.g. havoc in havoc.g)
14:55.06 starseeker sometimes you want to quickly show different aspects of a design
14:55.17 brlcad starseeker: that's more the exception than the rule, depends which org/person is modeling
14:55.39 brlcad for a decade, the convention was to group your primary into an "all.g" object
14:55.59 starseeker models can get very complex, and if you want to show someone just "this part, this part, and this part" multiple times in different situations it's a quick and easy way to have it available
14:56.16 starseeker brlcad: that's unfortuante, really - it would be a very logical convention
14:57.18 starseeker elena: then in that case I'd suggest presenting the user with visuals of the top level objects and let them tell you which ones to pay attention to :-/
14:57.56 elena ok. i'll try to do that.
14:58.20 elena then submitting has to be a two step process.
14:58.25 brlcad starseeker: remember the filename can vary drastically (stryker_dlo_20040329.g) too .. I wouldn't assume anything based on filename
14:58.37 brlcad you can't even really assume it's a top-level you want, but that's a good starting point
14:58.45 elena first submit the file, then (next step) select the object names.
14:58.47 brlcad elena: what you could do is simply show them the hierarchy
14:58.50 brlcad let them pick the point
14:59.03 brlcad for simple formats, it's just an object, or list of objects
14:59.06 d-lo will ignore the stryker comment... :P
14:59.26 brlcad for hierarchical formats, you display a collapsed tree
14:59.54 elena maybe multiple select?
14:59.58 brlcad sure
15:00.03 elena ok.
15:00.07 brlcad but selecting selects that entire subtree
15:00.15 elena yes.
15:00.46 brlcad hm, actually there's no real need to impose that limitation .. it's just whatever nodes they select
15:01.22 elena yes. it's more in tone with the hello world example :)
15:03.23 brlcad chuckles that dlo is the name of an ipod/iphone accessory manufacturer, particularly in the context of stryker
15:03.38 brlcad and then there's the stryker sonoma winery ;)
15:04.46 d-lo wha.... I'm getting a lawyer! They stolededed my irc handle!
15:18.44 *** join/#brlcad BigAToo (n=BigAToo@64.74.225.82)
15:34.34 starseeker d-lo: so with a lawyer, you'll be both broke and annoyed rather than just annoyed? ;-)
15:35.26 d-lo lol nice. unless... wait a minute.... a close relative ISA lawyer and owes me a favor.... hrm.....
15:36.30 d-lo visualizes himself standing ontop of a burning, ruined building which use to be 'dlo HQ - makers of iPhone/iPod accessories"...
15:38.06 ``Erik heh, 'cept dlo.com is a subsidiary of phillips
15:38.33 d-lo orly? Phillips wants some too eh?
15:38.38 ``Erik imagines they might have a bit of legal flex :D plus going back to '01
15:39.37 d-lo i can see it now on /. : Philips Legal dept gets omgwtfpwnd by loudmouth government employee....
15:39.44 d-lo =D
15:40.42 ``Erik given the accuracy of /. headlines and summaries, that might be posted
15:41.12 ``Erik that bug totally owned that speeding car, look at that ugly greasemark on the grill! PWN3d!#~@
15:41.38 louipc why not just ask the user what object he/she wants to use for the preview pic?
15:42.13 starseeker still has not forgiven slashdot for that premature/wrong announcement of the original Apollo 11 tapes turning up
15:42.22 starseeker talk about a letdown...
15:42.34 louipc hah
15:43.26 starseeker bets they were erased and re-used - sounds just like "policy" on such tapes... heck with history, it's the policy and we're following it
15:43.33 d-lo lol
15:44.15 d-lo at the viewing of those Apollo 11 tapes, somehow pron ends up on the overhead screen....lol
15:44.30 starseeker that really does suck big time - one of the great events in the history of human beings AS A SPECIES and they went missing
15:44.31 ``Erik was just thinking that o.O
15:44.34 starseeker cries
15:45.09 d-lo starseeker: didn't you hear? thats tnhe main reason we are going back in 2020... gotta remake the tapes.
15:45.13 ``Erik "houston, apogee attained, now firin*TSSHT* uhh uhhh uhhh oh yeah uhhh"
15:45.33 d-lo Apollo 11... is that a funky saxaphone?
15:45.53 louipc yeah you'd think they'd save something like that
15:46.33 starseeker still wants to figure out some way to spend a decade or two with the Saturn V technical archives and a wide format scanner in his retirement years...
15:47.06 ``Erik and then model it down to the bolt threads?
15:47.24 starseeker you got it
15:47.40 d-lo ...for the hallibut?
15:48.00 ``Erik biggest cadpeen ever
15:49.12 starseeker thinks such an accomplishment is worth documenting in detail
15:49.45 louipc well, it's on paper :D
15:49.57 starseeker louipc: my point exactly :-/
15:50.32 ``Erik paper isn't what it used to be, 60's paper and ink are probably already in bad shape :/
15:50.38 starseeker and everything I've see suggests that the filing system used is probably.... well... I guess we'll got with inadequate
15:50.48 ``Erik acidic paper eats itself up
15:50.52 ``Erik ask tufte O.o
15:51.25 louipc so this is something you probably want to do now, rather than wait for retirement...
15:52.39 starseeker louipc: I have no clue how to get the funding it would take to do that, even assuming they would let me...
15:53.53 starseeker plus, I've got a few things to do first :-)
15:54.07 starseeker doesn't want to model a Saturn V with mged as a modeler...
15:54.24 louipc haha
15:54.41 louipc yeah but the scanning will be enough work
15:54.51 starseeker that's for sure
15:55.02 d-lo modling it by hand would be faster :)
15:55.17 d-lo holey bad speling dai batman...
15:55.26 ``Erik sure you do, perfect way to isolate usability issues in the interface and fix 'em :D
15:56.21 starseeker the stages would be 1. high res scan every sheet of paper related 2. invent an organizational scheme that would actually work and sort everything into it 3. recruit the internet to make svg versions of the 2d drawings so you can actually work with 'em 4. cad model that baby
15:56.26 brlcad starseeker: more than likely, it's like our taps -- there's a bigass stack of a couple hundred sitting off in some room, maybe a summer intern or two worked on archiving, but mostly still gestating
15:56.41 brlcad s/taps/tapes/
15:56.58 ``Erik crowdsourcing, pheer
15:57.00 starseeker brlcad: fingers crossed - if that's the case they might yet be found
15:57.44 brlcad I doubt they're actually "lost" .. there's probably just only two or three people that know where they're at, just like ours :)
15:57.58 ``Erik heh
15:57.59 starseeker ``Erik: inkscape + 2000 space nerds with no social life - that's a force to be respected ;-)
15:58.36 starseeker expensive part is a wide format scanner plus the manhours of scanning required
15:59.04 starseeker wonders why he didn't think of trying to get that into the stimulus bill...
15:59.06 ``Erik just a few years ago, they found the french commission papers for the two "english" ships captain kidd had taken, supposedly proof that he was a legal privateer and not a pirate O.o misplaced media is a bitch
15:59.33 starseeker heh
15:59.55 ``Erik hung because someone misfiled a paper
15:59.59 louipc you have to get into NASA before step 1
16:00.20 starseeker louipc: actually, their records are part of the public archives now (at least from that era)
16:00.24 starseeker some of them, anyway
16:00.32 louipc oh cool
16:01.22 starseeker check out this dude's site: http://www.ibiblio.org/apollo/
16:02.00 ``Erik nasa doesn't have the budget or impetus to be very secretive O.o they mostly use russian agencies for lifting these days heh
16:03.12 starseeker specifically, http://www.ibiblio.org/apollo/QuestForInfo.html
16:04.26 starseeker he's done some Really Impressive Work digging up info
16:05.06 starseeker the government archives are beyond doubt repositories of lots of really neat historical treasures that nobody knows how to find and nobody cares enough to sort through
16:10.59 ``Erik shoulda brought in a tv dinner
16:13.16 *** join/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@c-68-51-75-169.hsd1.il.comcast.net)
16:14.25 jdoliner sean slash indianlarry, or anyone else who's interested. Would you be help me with an algorithm here?
16:14.35 jdoliner I'm kind of stuck
16:15.19 ``Erik what algo?
16:15.59 jdoliner unfortunately I don't have the name so I'll have to describe it
16:16.12 ``Erik psuedocode in pastebin?
16:16.26 jdoliner pastebin?
16:16.51 jdoliner it's more I need help devising the algorithm
16:16.56 ``Erik http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/
16:16.59 ``Erik ah, ok
16:17.06 ``Erik shuts up and listens
16:18.15 jdoliner so I have my code all setup to take two meshes, and return as polylines the trimming curves between them
16:19.06 jdoliner so that's nice and all but know I need to talk that polyline and use it to split each mesh into two meshes, the one inside the other mesh and the one outside
16:19.11 jdoliner and I'
16:19.14 jdoliner m not sure
16:19.21 jdoliner of the best way to do that
16:19.36 jdoliner do you think it's a better idea to do it afterward using the polyline
16:20.10 ``Erik by "mesh", you don't mean a mesh, but a NURBS, right?
16:21.22 jdoliner no I mean an ON_Mesh
16:21.52 jdoliner it's still discrete geometry at this point and not parametric
16:21.53 ``Erik painkillers have me fuzzy, here, I'll throw something at the back of indianlarrys head
16:22.33 ``Erik if it's triangles, any line cutting through a triangle will produce 2 triangles... I d'no ON_Mesh
16:22.46 indianlarry hey joe
16:22.48 jdoliner it's triangles or quads
16:22.49 jdoliner hi
16:23.02 indianlarry catchin up...
16:23.27 jdoliner but lines don't necessarily cut all the way through on a triangle
16:23.36 ``Erik (wait, some lines will produce a quad, but those can be broken into two triangles)
16:23.46 jdoliner yeah
16:24.18 jdoliner but you could also have a triangle broken up by not just one line but a whole bunch of little lines
16:24.37 jdoliner if for example one mesh has much smaller details than the other
16:25.22 ``Erik by casting vertex to vertex, you can cut polygons into triangles
16:26.32 ``Erik do it recursively and you have a fully triangulated mesh *shrug* but the vicodin has me goofy, indianlarry will come up with something brilliant here...
16:26.33 jdoliner yes, on of my ideas involves doing that
16:27.24 indianlarry definitely need resolution to capture the smallest details
16:27.51 indianlarry we are currently working similar issue with nurbs trims
16:27.54 ``Erik (mebbe an aggressive splitting algo followed by a decimation pass?)
16:28.07 jdoliner no I'm not
16:28.30 jdoliner oh you are sry
16:28.48 jdoliner so here's my one idea which I think could work
16:29.19 jdoliner right now I have it all setup to find every intersection line
16:29.28 jdoliner load it into an array
16:29.45 jdoliner and then at the end it goes through and reconstructs these into the polylines
16:30.05 jdoliner now instead of doing exactly that
16:30.39 jdoliner I can keep track of which faces the lines came from
16:31.09 jdoliner by loading them into arrays for each face
16:31.16 indianlarry i would think you'd want to track which face it belongs too
16:32.17 indianlarry need to remember that trimming edges within a face have to show direction/inner/outer
16:32.18 jdoliner yeah then when I run my algorithm on the lines from each seperate face. I get a polyline that indicates exactly how each face should be split up
16:32.31 jdoliner yes that's my question
16:32.35 jdoliner how should I do that
16:32.37 jdoliner ?
16:33.04 indianlarry just thinking out loud
16:33.43 jdoliner well I can test points for being inside or outside the meshes
16:33.46 indianlarry if your intersection coisides with an outer edge at any point the intersection becomes an outer edge ?
16:33.58 indianlarry sorry coincides
16:34.17 jdoliner sry I don't follow
16:34.23 jdoliner waht do you mean by outer edge
16:34.24 jdoliner ?
16:34.56 indianlarry guess your working with simple faces which only have an outer trim?
16:35.05 jdoliner yeah
16:36.10 indianlarry a corner intersecting a face could still produce an inner loop?
16:36.28 jdoliner yes
16:38.10 jdoliner so one option that I see
16:38.31 jdoliner is that I can pretty easily test a point for being inside our outside a mesh
16:38.52 jdoliner it just takes linear time with the number of triangles
16:39.07 jdoliner (which is kinda big)
16:39.14 jdoliner but once I have that point
16:39.20 jdoliner then anything that's connected to it
16:40.18 jdoliner is also on the same side of the mesh
16:41.45 jdoliner so we would really only need to do one point per connected region which isn't so unreasonable
16:43.24 indianlarry do brep meshes have trim loops or do they just get subdivided into smaller meshes
16:44.15 jdoliner they do not have trim loops
16:44.29 indianlarry okay
16:47.58 indianlarry you'd thnk there wold be a way to track edge direction to help out here
16:49.11 indianlarry ust keep visualizing the corner into the center of a face problem
16:50.39 jdoliner k, will do
16:50.48 indianlarry each facet or quad has defined outward pointing normal?
16:51.08 jdoliner yes, by right hand rule
16:51.35 jdoliner hmm
16:51.58 jdoliner I think I need to look back at my lower level functions
16:52.41 indianlarry each facet or quad that is intersected could then be subdivided into inside outside?
16:52.48 jdoliner I bet that they consistantly indicate something with the direction the resultant edge points
16:53.07 indianlarry thats how they do it with the nurbs trims
16:54.21 indianlarry you could almost create your own polyline trimming loops
16:56.00 jdoliner yeah I think I can
16:56.08 jdoliner I mean I think that's what my code in the present state does
16:56.26 indianlarry need to keep the loops by face then inner/outter
16:57.11 *** join/#brlcad BigAToo (n=BigAToo@pool-96-230-124-196.sbndin.btas.verizon.net)
16:58.08 jdoliner oh here's an interesting fact:
16:58.51 jdoliner if we intersect triangles abc and def
16:59.37 jdoliner then the dot product of (d-a) and the normal of abc is positive if d is on the external side of abc
17:03.06 indianlarry just tells you which side d is on holds for any point
17:05.29 jdoliner yeah, it only indicates ternality if there's nothing intersecting def between the line that abc leaves and d
17:08.58 indianlarry if you store the intersect polyline by face you should be able to use it with right-hand-rule to subdivide you facets/mesh
17:10.00 indianlarry if polyline intersects face edge its an outer type loop otherwise an inner loop
18:01.30 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03irpguardian * r34894 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/human.c:
18:01.30 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: Added needed data to allow poseable left arm, with connected parts and joints.
18:01.33 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: Bounding boxes for those limbs have been removed until a better method is devised.
18:05.56 *** join/#brlcad _sushi_ (n=_sushi_@80-218-237-16.dclient.hispeed.ch)
18:26.11 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r34895 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/cc.c: cc : input from commandline rather than hardcoded data
19:00.25 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34896 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/Makefile.am: we needed the mged_LINK in order to override LDFLAGS when we had a custom tk, but that's not the case any longer. problem came up where we needed one of the globally set LDFLAGS.
19:04.34 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34897 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac:
19:04.36 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: apply a fugly workaround for the Mac OS X 10.5 linker problem whereby it fails
19:04.38 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: saying 'ld: cycle in dylib re-exports with /usr/X11/lib/libGL.dylib'. the
19:04.42 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: problem appears to be the glx internals making calls into the GL framework,
19:04.44 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: which ends up finding the wrong (same) dylib during load. the 'fix' is to tell
19:04.49 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: it exactly where the framework dylib lives, which is done via a project-wide
19:04.51 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: LDFLAGS so we don't have to pollute all the places it would be needed.
19:44.04 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34898 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: mged rotation halts after a few events once a model is e'd up and you zoom in/out (at least with mouse). seems to be specific to mac 10.5
19:45.25 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34899 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: kill command (and probably others) in archer is horked.
20:07.56 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r34900 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: mged crashes inside X_choose_visual() with default X11 libdm interface on mac os x 10.5 (fbserv seemed to be fine)
20:56.41 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03irpguardian * r34901 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/human.c:
20:56.42 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: Created a new function for creating the entire left arm, allowing for the arm to pivot
20:56.44 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: around the shoulder joint, and have all connected parts of the arm point in the same
20:56.46 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: direction.
21:33.33 elena how can I ran multiple mged commands from the command line?
21:33.56 elena something like mged -cr something.g "tops;tops"
21:37.31 elena I got it.
21:39.26 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03ebautu * r34902 10/web/trunk/htdocs/more/sites/all/modules/brlcad/brlcad.module: Update BRL-CAD module (raytracing code is work in progress).
21:40.03 brlcad something exactly like that
21:40.43 elena i only got it working with echo -e tops\\ntops | mged -cr something.g
21:41.21 CIA-32 BRL-CAD: 03Ebautu 07http://brlcad.org * r1517 10/wiki/More_Changelog: /* June, 17 - today */
21:41.38 elena going to bed. have a great afternoon.
22:06.19 mafm uh
22:06.34 mafm elena working in raytracing code?
22:07.02 louipc to generate preview images for the model repository
22:07.15 mafm oh
22:07.30 mafm I was getting worried about creating a raytracer in php or something :P
22:07.43 louipc bahhah
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22:08.14 mafm brl-cad web on esteroids :P
22:08.25 ``Erik raytracer in javascript, pheer
22:10.57 mafm :D
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23:01.12 Ralith_ d-lo: I've got several ideas, although my first hacks didn't pan out.
23:01.30 Ralith_ they're just getting increasingly nontrivial and equally not guaranteed to success
23:03.38 ``Erik anything guaranteed to succeed is boring O.o d-lo probably won't see this for another 12 hours or so, though
23:10.09 Ralith true enough
23:11.16 louipc what is guaranteed to success?
23:15.28 ``Erik bets he could write "hello world" and get it to compile the very first time :D
23:17.22 mafm ``Erik: but it will be buggy! http://www.ddj.com/hpc-high-performance-computing/217801225
23:18.03 ``Erik that's too much reading for me, I'm illiterate
23:18.35 starseeker Ralith: have you considered contacting the Qt folks to see if they can steer you towards the parts working the reset magic?
23:19.09 mafm (erm, page 2, about errors of "hello world" programs in C)
23:19.10 mafm :D
23:19.28 starseeker might also be a good opener if we need to propose some changes to include in the next Qt
23:19.39 mafm that's fine ``Erik, you just reminded me about the recently read article
23:19.52 Ralith starseeker: I found lots of magic-looking code in QGraphicsView::render, but I'm not sure I can use it without modifying Qt
23:19.56 Ralith which seems like a worst-case.
23:20.05 ``Erik who said C? :D
23:20.13 Ralith QGraphicsScene*
23:20.43 Ralith then again, perhaps I could simply introduce some redundancy...
23:21.25 starseeker Ralith: redundancy?
23:21.50 Ralith starseeker: the big block of setup code in the render function might be practical to extract into the g3d code.
23:21.58 starseeker ah
23:22.06 starseeker might do for a start, certainly
23:22.12 starseeker especially if it works ;-)
23:22.13 Ralith my original thought was to slightly rework Qt itself to do that without the redundancy
23:22.25 louipc haha writeln
23:22.27 Ralith but that'd undesirable and I now realise perhaps unnecessary
23:22.39 starseeker nods
23:22.53 starseeker we've already got Ogre back in svn, so that's the easier mod target to start with
23:23.19 Ralith and one of the nice things about using Qt is that many already have it installed; using a customized version negates that.
23:24.00 starseeker I wouldn't be afraid of redundancy at this stage - if it works we can try to work with Qt/Ogre to find the "correct/pretty" way later
23:24.31 Ralith yeah.
23:24.47 starseeker drags self off to gym
23:25.19 mafm ``Erik: probably the guy who wrote the article can find bugs in any other languages, given the length of the "lecture" about errors in C hello world programs :)
23:29.43 ``Erik O.o so, uh, checking the return value of a function is... well... ALL of his argument there? weak :)
23:30.32 Ralith urgh.
23:30.42 Ralith this init code requires stuff only render knows about :/
23:54.08 ``Erik yeesh, goblin sharks are creepy

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