| 00:28.36 | ``Erik | heh http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1924624 |
| 00:53.03 | brlcad | heh |
| 00:53.14 | brlcad | "wellll... we gotta get rid of the body" |
| 01:01.40 | ``Erik | these days, cellphones are KNOWN to have health risks |
| 01:02.10 | starseeker | ? |
| 01:02.57 | starseeker | getting beat up if talking loud on one in a diner? |
| 01:03.08 | ``Erik | watch the collegehumor video... :D |
| 01:03.13 | starseeker | ah |
| 01:08.30 | ``Erik | "Yeah, well, when I was in prison, we used to sneak stuff in by hiding it up our ass." "I've got some fudge hidden up my ass, you want some?" |
| 01:09.10 | starseeker | "there's an app for that" taken to new heights (or lows) |
| 01:19.19 | starseeker | ``Erik: is there a reason to keep mysql.txt in the repository? |
| 01:19.26 | starseeker | (isst) |
| 01:20.19 | *** join/#brlcad R0b0t1 (n=Enigma@unaffiliated/r0b0t1) | |
| 01:38.46 | starseeker | ``Erik: isst doesn't work for mouse movement on my home box either |
| 01:38.56 | starseeker | (gentoo) |
| 01:39.04 | starseeker | gtk 2.18.3 I believe |
| 02:17.06 | starseeker | eyes libsdl... |
| 02:26.50 | CIA-41 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r36790 10/isst/trunk/mysql.txt: dead file |
| 02:27.00 | ``Erik | thought I"d killed it a long time ago, seeing it in your dir is why I thought you had an old checkout |
| 02:27.26 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 02:27.31 | starseeker | nope, just checked it out |
| 02:27.51 | starseeker | am I right that a lot of isst.c gets reused when using a different toolkit? |
| 02:28.11 | ``Erik | there should be no isst.c |
| 02:28.25 | starseeker | er isst-gtk.c |
| 02:28.59 | ``Erik | uhhhh, there's no isst-gtk.c either |
| 02:29.18 | starseeker | fine gui.c :-) |
| 02:29.20 | ``Erik | none of it should be re-used, but look at local_worker.c for the interface |
| 02:29.33 | starseeker | k |
| 02:29.37 | ``Erik | gui.c is the gtk+ mess |
| 02:30.36 | ``Erik | the big switch statement will eventually be a single function with a name passed to support a plugin system |
| 02:31.21 | starseeker | nods |
| 02:40.52 | starseeker | growl... |
| 02:53.30 | ``Erik | ? |
| 02:54.36 | starseeker | looking for a good toolkit option |
| 02:54.57 | starseeker | agar looks like the winner from the libsdl side, but it has a custom build system and the svn version doesn't compile |
| 02:55.10 | starseeker | Tk has a bunch of... funky options |
| 02:57.08 | starseeker | Qt might be an option... wonder how fast Qpixmap is |
| 02:58.28 | starseeker | we're going to use Qt someday anyhow |
| 03:09.40 | starseeker | HMMM. http://labs.trolltech.com/blogs/2009/11/10/qt3d-features-in-qt-46/ |
| 03:12.42 | ``Erik | um, qpainter2d |
| 03:12.55 | starseeker | ah |
| 03:13.01 | starseeker | you looked into it already? |
| 03:13.04 | ``Erik | jabba has a fast paint buffer for 2d games |
| 03:13.05 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 03:13.15 | starseeker | is it viable? |
| 03:13.21 | ``Erik | which? |
| 03:13.25 | starseeker | Qt |
| 03:13.35 | ``Erik | the qpainter stuff might be adequate, I dunno |
| 03:13.44 | ``Erik | the java stuff is used in 2d games, so it's up to snuff |
| 03:14.09 | ``Erik | 2d game stuff seems like the richest source for this kinda info |
| 03:15.18 | ``Erik | glTexSubImage2D might be the shizzle for portability on 3d gpu equiped machiens |
| 03:15.30 | starseeker | nods |
| 03:17.06 | starseeker | hmm. what's OpenVG I wonder... |
| 03:17.34 | ``Erik | vector graphics out of khronos? |
| 03:17.53 | starseeker | who's khronos? |
| 03:18.14 | starseeker | oh |
| 03:18.18 | starseeker | open standards group |
| 03:18.21 | ``Erik | um, iirc, a consortium glued together to make an ogl replacement that failed? |
| 03:19.07 | ``Erik | farenheit or something? |
| 03:19.52 | starseeker | opengl es? |
| 03:21.57 | starseeker | heh - cool agar dev responded on irc |
| 03:22.11 | starseeker | compiles again... |
| 03:26.44 | starseeker | ouch - that make doesn't take a -j option... |
| 03:28.32 | ``Erik | not sounding so incredibly awesome... |
| 03:28.42 | starseeker | yeah |
| 03:29.01 | starseeker | dunno why he doesn't just use autotools or some such... |
| 03:30.15 | starseeker | I'll say this for him - I didn't see much in the way of warnings during the compile |
| 03:31.09 | ``Erik | -Wnone ? :D |
| 03:31.14 | starseeker | hehe |
| 03:31.32 | starseeker | could be |
| 03:31.46 | ``Erik | wonders where he put the widget toolkit he wrote ontop of sdl O.o |
| 03:32.02 | starseeker | ah, here are some errors |
| 03:32.09 | starseeker | just early in the build when I wasn't watching |
| 03:32.10 | starseeker | k |
| 03:32.46 | starseeker | hang on, may have fed it a malformed -j option... |
| 03:36.43 | starseeker | hmm, weird |
| 03:39.06 | starseeker | almost works - only fails on first attempt after a clean svn checkout |
| 03:39.19 | starseeker | pastebins for the devs |
| 03:39.37 | starseeker | ah, well - not much chance we'd use it anyway, but I'm curious |
| 03:46.36 | Ralith | er |
| 03:46.47 | Ralith | isn't the khronos group responsible for OGL itself? |
| 03:47.32 | Ralith | (also, OpenGL ES is a portable complement to OpenGL which, afaik, is active and successful) |
| 03:47.55 | starseeker | yeah, I guess that's true enough |
| 03:48.12 | starseeker | thought ES was intended to be the next OGL, but got shot down (for now at least) |
| 03:48.45 | Ralith | nope |
| 03:48.48 | Ralith | just a trimmed down version |
| 03:49.13 | Ralith | you're probably thinking of OpenGL 3, which had lots of exciting new features that got scrapped right before the spec was finalized |
| 03:49.28 | Ralith | (although I'm told most of them made it back into the 3.2 spec, which is out, so that's not so bad) |
| 03:49.48 | starseeker | heh |
| 03:49.54 | starseeker | Ralith: how goes school? |
| 03:50.54 | ``Erik | yeh, looks like khronos does ogl now, guess to fill the void sgi left... es is 'embedded' |
| 03:51.01 | Ralith | pretty good; just yesterday finished my last major assignment |
| 03:51.07 | starseeker | sweet |
| 03:51.11 | ``Erik | grats |
| 03:51.14 | Ralith | intro CS course was predictably blarg |
| 03:51.18 | starseeker | heh |
| 03:51.24 | Ralith | the prof didn't even really know what he was talking about >.< |
| 03:51.33 | starseeker | yeah, that sucks |
| 03:51.56 | Ralith | but I remain hopeful, as my discrete math and logic & computer design courses were both very good. |
| 03:54.59 | starseeker | excellent |
| 03:55.13 | starseeker | so you feel like some Ogre+Qt hacking? ;-) |
| 03:57.44 | starseeker | feels a trifle guilty about spending time on Agar... darn curiosity... |
| 11:45.53 | *** join/#brlcad parigaudi (n=quassel@pd95b7f5e.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) | |
| 13:19.53 | ``Erik | "are there any open source tools to deal with access .mdb files?" "rm" |
| 13:20.10 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14BF38.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:21.42 | archivist | rm -rf as its a windows box /me ducks |
| 14:10.07 | ``Erik | frikkin' tkhtml3 (AGAIN) |
| 14:11.23 | starseeker | now what is it doing (or not doing) |
| 14:11.36 | ``Erik | ignoring CPPFLAGS |
| 14:11.55 | starseeker | kinda regrets not just doing the tkimg style hack build - that at least worked most of the time... |
| 14:12.42 | starseeker | ``Erik: that might be a Makefile.in issue? |
| 14:13.11 | ``Erik | it happens during ./configure |
| 14:13.28 | starseeker | never did get the hang of merging TEA building and automake's Makefile.am, although I suppose I should try it again... |
| 14:13.31 | starseeker | ah |
| 14:13.49 | ``Erik | ./configure CPPFLAGS=-I/some/path/include/tk8.5/ and tkhtml3's subconfigur bitches about not finding tk.h |
| 14:14.48 | ``Erik | doesn't remember if it ever worked right O.o |
| 14:14.50 | starseeker | try --with-tkinclude |
| 14:16.11 | starseeker | gets cadtools running... and watches the widgets behave funky |
| 14:16.18 | starseeker | yep, not ready for prime time |
| 14:17.00 | ``Erik | heh |
| 14:17.26 | ``Erik | tries to act surprised O:-) |
| 14:18.06 | starseeker | <snort> - it's not like I am |
| 14:18.33 | starseeker | just worth checking - it confirms that an SDL solution means writing our own local widgets as well |
| 14:19.14 | ``Erik | or figuring out how to hijack the sdl's SDL_Display shtuffz |
| 14:19.25 | ``Erik | sam's a pretty laid back guy, he might be cool with taking a patch |
| 14:19.46 | starseeker | what'd you have in mind? |
| 14:20.08 | ``Erik | no clue |
| 14:20.44 | ``Erik | iirc, when you set up a window or context in SDL, it's very oriented towards having a single window, SDL_InitVideo() or something bangs on globals and stuf |
| 14:20.48 | starseeker | kinda sounds like using another toolkit with it would entail similar issues to Ogre + Qt |
| 14:21.39 | ``Erik | oh, SDL_SetVideoMode() |
| 14:22.10 | ``Erik | hrm, SDL_SwapBuffers(); uses the global surface |
| 14:22.15 | starseeker | yeah, seeing similar stuff - the tcl-demo code shows tcl/tk controlling sdl, which is OK, simple and might work, but it's not immediately clear if it would also allow 3D manipulation controls and ray firing in SDL |
| 14:22.38 | ``Erik | didja look at local_worker.c ? |
| 14:22.48 | starseeker | glanced at it |
| 14:23.17 | starseeker | was more trying to figure out what container to put around the adrt stuff before digging into adrt |
| 14:23.38 | starseeker | s/adrt/isst |
| 14:23.42 | ``Erik | well, digging through that tiny file tells you what kinda container you're looking for :D |
| 14:23.50 | starseeker | heh |
| 14:23.59 | starseeker | fair enough |
| 14:24.11 | starseeker | also got sidtracked into reading about NURBS till about 1am |
| 14:24.14 | starseeker | (brain hurts) |
| 14:24.32 | ``Erik | ponders digging up old svgalib code and figuring out how to do an isst that way :> |
| 14:24.42 | starseeker | ew ew ew |
| 14:25.05 | starseeker | doesn't think he's heard of svgalib for years |
| 14:25.34 | ``Erik | http://brlcad.org/~erik/files/warp.c heh |
| 14:26.04 | starseeker | hehe |
| 14:27.43 | ``Erik | (how the hell did that even work?) |
| 14:27.56 | starseeker | black magic |
| 14:28.13 | starseeker | heads in - see ya in a bit |
| 14:28.18 | ``Erik | it's gotta be setaling shit off the stack |
| 14:28.18 | starseeker | (if you're in) |
| 14:28.26 | ``Erik | linux musta REALLY sucked to make that work |
| 14:29.16 | starseeker | makes a note to study this code and see if sdl window interactions are compatible with it... http://www.libsdl.org/projects/tcl-demo/ |
| 14:29.55 | starseeker | if so, might have some fun with mged, libsdl and adrt... |
| 15:08.56 | ``Erik | cooks up a bench run on this fpu-less ARM thingy :> |
| 16:48.53 | *** join/#brlcad cosurgi (n=cosurgi@atak.bl.pg.gda.pl) | |
| 16:51.34 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14BF38.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 17:40.06 | ``Erik | AWESOME, negative infinity logarithmic vgr's! |
| 17:40.26 | ``Erik | Benchmark results indicate an approximate VGR performance metric of 0 |
| 17:40.26 | ``Erik | Logarithmic VGR metric is -inf (natural logarithm is -inf) |
| 17:40.32 | ``Erik | Abs OpenRD 11386.64 6382.36 6583.38 5773.79 6654.10 7956.48 Thu Dec 4 12:38:24 EST 2031 |
| 17:45.24 | ``Erik | ah |
| 17:45.25 | ``Erik | erik@OpenRD ~/src/brlcad/bench$ bc |
| 17:45.25 | ``Erik | bash: bc: command not found |
| 17:49.18 | starseeker | supposes sanity checks are in order... |
| 17:49.32 | starseeker | bc, time, other things available on any SANE system... |
| 17:50.39 | ``Erik | yeah, need to get linux off of that thing and bring up freebsd... |
| 18:41.27 | *** join/#brlcad johnson_dm_ (n=johnson_@mail.piasecki.com) | |
| 18:41.58 | starseeker | looks like this might have some hints for metaball->NURBS conversion: http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=10.1.1.49.9803 |
| 18:48.40 | ``Erik | interesting |
| 18:49.31 | ``Erik | I'd have to read it more carefully to see if the representations line up the same for the initial data... their approach looks like a good fit for the blinn style surface, but mebbe not the iso one I have |
| 18:49.54 | ``Erik | spheres and saddles as the patches, wasn't even thinking of cutting the surface up like that heh |
| 18:51.46 | starseeker | might not be stricly necessary - another possible approach might be to generate control points based on the isopotential gradients... if some mapping can be found that makes sense... |
| 18:52.05 | starseeker | might be a legitimate paper in there somewhere |
| 18:52.13 | ``Erik | well, given that code now exists to find the surface between two points, ... *shrug* |
| 18:52.47 | starseeker | yeah, but when defining the NURBS curve you want to (as much as possible) match the surface curvature, not just smoothly intersect a subset of points |
| 18:52.51 | starseeker | that might be trickier |
| 18:52.53 | starseeker | not sure |
| 18:53.45 | ``Erik | approximating curvature should be reasonably straightforward with a set of nearby intersections |
| 18:53.49 | starseeker | obviously a surface tree approach and some sort of "flat isopotential within box" approach would let us get very close... |
| 18:54.42 | starseeker | yeah, there's probably some sort of mathy "combinations of radial potentials result in surface curvature of yada..." math that could/should be done... |
| 19:00.18 | *** join/#brlcad juantelez (n=juan@unaffiliated/juantelez) | |
| 19:00.22 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@249.Red-88-11-185.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) | |
| 19:00.39 | juantelez | hi all |
| 19:01.00 | *** join/#brlcad Nohla (n=jesica@201.255.245.8) | |
| 19:01.11 | juantelez | I have a friend that want to translate the documentation to spanish, here she is |
| 19:01.22 | juantelez | hola Nohla :) |
| 19:01.34 | juantelez | esperemos a ver que dicen, jeje |
| 19:02.04 | starseeker | howdy :-) |
| 19:02.16 | juantelez | hi starseeker |
| 19:02.41 | starseeker | Nohla: hola :-) |
| 19:03.16 | starseeker | unfortunately I don't speak much spanish - I think brlcad speaks some though |
| 19:03.21 | Nohla | starseeker, hola, sabes español? |
| 19:03.34 | Nohla | ah ok |
| 19:03.35 | starseeker | Nohla: no :-( |
| 19:03.42 | juantelez | i have very little experince whit wiki, and, and I'm affraid that if i edit the documentation the english documentation will be lost and all of you will came to my house and kill me |
| 19:03.44 | juantelez | jaja |
| 19:03.51 | starseeker | hehe |
| 19:04.18 | starseeker | actually, what I would suggest is working with the docbook documentation in our tree |
| 19:04.29 | juantelez | starseeker: do you know how we can edit the doc to translate it whitout erase anything? |
| 19:04.40 | juantelez | let me see |
| 19:04.40 | starseeker | we eventually want to get to the point where that is integrated into the wiki, but we aren't there yet |
| 19:04.53 | starseeker | juantelez: do you have a copy of the brlcad source code? |
| 19:05.01 | juantelez | starseeker: no |
| 19:05.02 | starseeker | er BRL-CAD (sorry brlcad) |
| 19:05.07 | starseeker | juantelez: ah |
| 19:05.10 | starseeker | ok, that's step one |
| 19:05.32 | juantelez | but we want to translate the doc not the program itself |
| 19:05.38 | starseeker | right |
| 19:05.41 | juantelez | ok |
| 19:05.45 | starseeker | the docs are in the source tree |
| 19:05.48 | juantelez | ok |
| 19:06.00 | juantelez | let me see if I could find it and download |
| 19:06.00 | starseeker | we create a docbook file, then build html, pdf and man pages from that one source file |
| 19:06.09 | juantelez | ok |
| 19:06.09 | starseeker | simplifies maintaining things no end |
| 19:06.18 | juantelez | ok |
| 19:06.41 | starseeker | what platform are you on? (Windows, Linux, ...) |
| 19:06.57 | juantelez | GNU/Linux |
| 19:07.04 | starseeker | http://sourceforge.net/projects/brlcad/files/BRL-CAD%20Source/7.16.2/brlcad-7.16.2.tar.gz/download |
| 19:07.08 | starseeker | latest release |
| 19:07.12 | juantelez | thanks starseeker !! |
| 19:07.15 | juantelez | Nohla: bajate eso |
| 19:07.27 | Nohla | juantelez, ya juan, lo estoy siguiendo |
| 19:07.28 | juantelez | Nohla: que el laburo heavy lo vas a hacer vos! yo soy solo el rrpp! jaja |
| 19:07.36 | Nohla | jajaja |
| 19:07.44 | juantelez | Nohla: no me cancheres porque te dejo sola, jaja |
| 19:08.01 | Nohla | juantelez, sola es cuando mas aprendo |
| 19:08.20 | starseeker | if you're not familiar with Docbook, it's an xml markup language (feels a little like html, but is much more abstract) |
| 19:09.53 | juantelez | starseeker: thanks a lot! |
| 19:09.57 | starseeker | when you expand the tarball, you will see inside the brlcad-7.16.2 directory a doc directory, and within that directory a docbook directory |
| 19:10.08 | juantelez | starseeker: i guess we will here bodering a lot! |
| 19:10.10 | juantelez | jaj |
| 19:10.54 | starseeker | the README file outlines the toplevel directories |
| 19:10.54 | Nohla | mmm, i thought it was easier |
| 19:11.21 | starseeker | the directory structure is laid out such that we can create es subdirectories just as we currently have en subdirectories |
| 19:11.21 | Nohla | juantelez, esa parte la hace vos? yo lo traduzco |
| 19:11.51 | starseeker | juantelez: if docbook is too much, you're welcome to start on whatever you care to |
| 19:11.56 | starseeker | all efforts are welcome |
| 19:12.16 | juantelez | :) |
| 19:12.26 | starseeker | if you're willing to work on the docbook level though, it will save converting the results to docbook later |
| 19:12.32 | juantelez | Nohla: bueno, dame ssh a tu maquina y te digo que traducir, jaja |
| 19:12.55 | starseeker | I recommend starting in the system/man1 directory |
| 19:13.04 | starseeker | those are manual pages, which are small and self contained |
| 19:13.14 | juantelez | starseeker: don't worry, Nohla just love to learn, so, she'll work with Docbook |
| 19:13.16 | juantelez | jaja |
| 19:13.38 | Nohla | starseeker, please, step by step |
| 19:14.00 | Nohla | and slower |
| 19:14.09 | starseeker | Nohla: you have brlcad-7.16.2.tar.gz? |
| 19:14.12 | Nohla | yes |
| 19:14.25 | starseeker | ok. run the following command: |
| 19:14.38 | starseeker | tar -xvzf brlcad-7.16.2.tar.gz |
| 19:15.06 | Nohla | done |
| 19:15.24 | starseeker | cd brlcad-7.16.2 |
| 19:15.37 | starseeker | cd doc/docbook |
| 19:15.51 | starseeker | cd system/man1 |
| 19:16.19 | starseeker | you should see a README file, a file called mged_cmd_template.xml, and a directory en |
| 19:17.30 | starseeker | for spanish documentation, we will create a directory at this level: |
| 19:17.33 | starseeker | mkdir es |
| 19:17.50 | starseeker | OK so far? |
| 19:18.40 | Nohla | ok |
| 19:19.09 | starseeker | ok. now, if you list the contents of the en directory, you will see many xml files: |
| 19:19.12 | starseeker | ls en/ |
| 19:20.00 | starseeker | these files are docbook files |
| 19:20.10 | starseeker | what editor do you prefer? (emacs, vi, etc.) |
| 19:20.53 | Nohla | vim |
| 19:21.00 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 19:21.41 | starseeker | ok, vim will work fine. If you care to investigate it later, there is an emacs tool called nxml that is useful for docbook files, but for now we will use vim |
| 19:21.58 | starseeker | so, open the first file: |
| 19:22.05 | starseeker | vim en/3ptarb.xml |
| 19:22.11 | Nohla | i have emacs, but ive neer usd it |
| 19:22.18 | Nohla | i can try if you help me |
| 19:22.24 | starseeker | no need for now |
| 19:22.43 | starseeker | it helps when doing docbook markup, but for a while you will simply be translating |
| 19:22.48 | starseeker | no markup change needed |
| 19:23.25 | Nohla | ok |
| 19:23.33 | starseeker | you have 3ptarb.xml open? |
| 19:23.45 | Nohla | yes |
| 19:24.26 | starseeker | OK. You see english sentences and paragraphs? |
| 19:24.32 | Nohla | ahá |
| 19:24.57 | starseeker | first sentence to translate is "Build an ARB8 shape by extruding a quadrilateral through a given thickness." |
| 19:25.24 | starseeker | the xml tangs inside <> brackets (like <refentrytitle>) do NOT get translated |
| 19:25.28 | starseeker | only content |
| 19:25.39 | Nohla | yes |
| 19:25.48 | starseeker | also, command and program names (3ptarb, MGED) must stay the same |
| 19:25.49 | Nohla | i saw that content |
| 19:25.55 | starseeker | good :-) |
| 19:26.12 | starseeker | so, now we quit vim and prepare to translate the file |
| 19:26.31 | starseeker | you made directory es earlier? |
| 19:26.32 | Nohla | so i should copy all de directory and trasleate just de explanations |
| 19:26.40 | starseeker | yes |
| 19:26.54 | Nohla | and let them in a diferent directory |
| 19:26.54 | starseeker | cp en/3ptarb.xml es/3ptarb.xml |
| 19:27.05 | starseeker | then edit es/3ptarb.xml |
| 19:27.12 | Nohla | wow |
| 19:27.20 | Nohla | it was easy |
| 19:27.52 | Nohla | i was near to do a lot of stupid things on wikibooks :) |
| 19:28.26 | starseeker | we would like to edit via wiki, but we must write new code for wiki engine to enable that - not done yet |
| 19:28.51 | starseeker | so, if acceptable, better to do it this way :-) |
| 19:29.03 | *** part/#brlcad johnson_dm_ (n=johnson_@mail.piasecki.com) | |
| 19:29.20 | Nohla | but i would like to put yhis on the web, where everyone can acces |
| 19:29.24 | Nohla | s |
| 19:29.49 | juantelez | thats the better part |
| 19:29.49 | starseeker | once you translate some files, we will build html output |
| 19:29.49 | starseeker | html can be uploaded to the wiki |
| 19:29.59 | Nohla | that was the problem that begin this idea |
| 19:30.08 | starseeker | nods |
| 19:30.28 | juantelez | the work that you are doing Nohla, doesn't work only with trnaslation, |
| 19:31.58 | Nohla | so, i`ll do the first tranlations |
| 19:32.18 | Nohla | the, how i give them to your proyect? |
| 19:32.31 | Nohla | to be offered with the download |
| 19:32.46 | juantelez | Nohla: que queres preguntar? |
| 19:32.51 | starseeker | once you have the first few done, we will check them over and add them to our source code repository |
| 19:32.52 | juantelez | Nohla: me parece que te hiciste quilobmo |
| 19:33.15 | Nohla | juantelez, el me entendio |
| 19:33.15 | starseeker | if they look good, brlcad may decide to allow you to commit directly to the sourceforge subversion repository |
| 19:33.29 | Nohla | juantelez, aprende spanglish y despues decime :) |
| 19:33.31 | juantelez | Nohla: entendes lo que estas haciendo? estas modificando el codigo de la fuente, despues compilas eso en html para que quede en la pagina |
| 19:33.52 | starseeker | initially, you can email them to the BRL-CAD email list |
| 19:33.53 | juantelez | Nohla: enntendes? |
| 19:34.00 | Nohla | juantelez, que si |
| 19:34.13 | Nohla | pero no esta en los repositorios si yo no lo mando |
| 19:34.16 | Nohla | solo en mi maquina |
| 19:34.24 | starseeker | http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=105292 |
| 19:34.46 | starseeker | brlcad-devel would be appropriate here, I believe |
| 19:35.10 | juantelez | Nohla: pero te esta diciendo, que lo mandes a la lista para que ellos lo subam o despues lo de brlcad_ y por ahi te autoriza para que hagas el commint vos directamente |
| 19:35.33 | juantelez | Nohla: fijate que tienen un par de listas de correo y foros |
| 19:35.44 | Nohla | que es el commint |
| 19:36.48 | starseeker | We manage our developent tree using subversion version control system: http://subversion.tigris.org/ |
| 19:37.48 | juantelez | Nohla: el proceso de subir lo que modificaste |
| 19:38.26 | Nohla | starseeker, stop again, step by step |
| 19:38.42 | Nohla | ill do the first, and then y return here for the following |
| 19:38.50 | starseeker | Nohla: ok. |
| 19:39.07 | Nohla | starseeker, if i do too much, ill leave it soon |
| 19:39.24 | Nohla | actually, i should be studing right now |
| 19:39.29 | starseeker | no hurry - work at your own pace |
| 19:39.29 | juantelez | jaja |
| 19:39.42 | juantelez | starseeker: where are you from? |
| 19:39.49 | starseeker | Maryland |
| 19:39.54 | starseeker | USA |
| 19:40.15 | juantelez | we are from Buenos Aires, Argentina |
| 19:40.25 | starseeker | very nice :-) |
| 19:40.44 | starseeker | thank you for your interest in BRL-CAD |
| 19:41.14 | Nohla | starseeker, thank to all you for bring BRLCAD |
| 19:41.39 | starseeker | Nohla: if you like doing translations, I will take you through next stages step by step - they are not needed yet |
| 19:41.41 | juantelez | jeje |
| 19:42.10 | juantelez | starseeker: in fact, her idea of transalate this came up as a need |
| 19:42.36 | Nohla | starseeker, ive never done translations before this |
| 19:42.40 | Nohla | :) |
| 19:42.57 | juantelez | starseeker: Nohla contributes a lot with the LUG of her Universty |
| 19:43.06 | starseeker | excellent :-) |
| 19:43.14 | juantelez | (former my university jaja) |
| 19:43.24 | Nohla | jajajja |
| 19:44.33 | juantelez | and a student from another area tell her that he want to learn to use brl-cad but the language barrer was stoping him |
| 19:45.08 | Nohla | starseeker, BRL is one (not the first) of the available software in raplace of autocad |
| 19:45.48 | Nohla | ive never seen a person who use it, and i never used it :) |
| 19:46.16 | Nohla | but a student came to an event with this problem |
| 19:46.22 | starseeker | nods |
| 19:46.32 | starseeker | yes, to use BRL-CAD you need to read the documentation |
| 19:46.41 | Nohla | he wanted to change completed to FS but he dont speak english |
| 19:47.40 | Nohla | so i offered him this work |
| 19:47.54 | starseeker | Nohla: thank you! |
| 19:47.55 | Nohla | for him and other people in his situation |
| 19:48.56 | Nohla | starseeker, there some apps or functions that autocad offer, but brl dont ? |
| 19:49.09 | starseeker | Once you are comfortable with docbook and translating, for beginners the files in doc/docbook/lessons are most important |
| 19:49.15 | Nohla | (sorry if it hard to understand me) |
| 19:49.19 | starseeker | Nohla: yes, autocad has features we do not |
| 19:49.23 | starseeker | no problem :-) |
| 19:49.36 | Nohla | starseeker, wich are them? |
| 19:49.54 | starseeker | we do not have much ability to do 2D blueprints/sketches |
| 19:50.03 | starseeker | QCAD is better for that |
| 19:50.08 | starseeker | BRL-CAD does solid modeling |
| 19:50.31 | starseeker | AutoCAD is more "polished", more user friendly |
| 19:51.48 | Nohla | so i will translate qcad :D |
| 19:52.25 | Nohla | we do not have much ability to do 2D blueprints/sketches:: starseeker, you will? |
| 19:53.03 | starseeker | someday, but it is not yet a priority |
| 19:53.18 | ``Erik | much work to be done and very few of us doing it |
| 19:53.21 | Nohla | why not? |
| 19:53.44 | starseeker | BRL-CAD is used to model three dimensional objects (like vehicles) for analysis |
| 19:54.02 | starseeker | blueprints are used more in manufacturing |
| 19:54.16 | Nohla | if you develop that skills i promise to do a good work on difussion |
| 19:54.22 | ``Erik | right now, the big pushes are for NURBS support (like Pro/E, unigraphics, rhino3d) and for an updated and modernized user interface |
| 19:54.37 | Nohla | but to the university it is necesary |
| 19:55.35 | ``Erik | have you seen http://brlcad.org/w/images/4/44/Industry_Diagram.pdf ? |
| 19:56.54 | starseeker | Nohla: we would love for someone in the BRL-CAD open source community to develop support for blueprint outputs, but until we have the available resources to devote to it we can't do them well yet |
| 19:57.09 | starseeker | Nohla: there IS rtedge, though: |
| 19:58.09 | starseeker | http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/havoc_rtedge.png.html |
| 19:59.21 | Nohla | wow |
| 20:00.43 | starseeker | we don't have all of the standard "blueprint" boxes and labels, but those can be created with (say) inkscape using an rtedge render as a starting point |
| 20:01.43 | starseeker | so 1. create 3D model in BRL-CAD 2. render hidden line wireframe with rtedge 3. import into inkscape and add necessary blueprint additions |
| 20:02.33 | Nohla | starseeker, you should now that i dont kwon how to use brl, and even the think its good to now for beginners |
| 20:03.02 | Nohla | there will be a lot of thing you will say that ill lose in the middle :) |
| 20:03.08 | starseeker | It's OK |
| 20:03.35 | starseeker | short version - you can do blueprint-like outputs, but not simple or feature-rich |
| 20:04.05 | Nohla | the one i know is that the FS have a piece of software on demand |
| 20:04.29 | Nohla | and im trying to do something to make one option more knowed |
| 20:04.33 | Nohla | just that |
| 20:04.42 | starseeker | thank you :-) |
| 20:05.38 | starseeker | Once you have translated a couple of files, please send them to brlcad-devel email list |
| 20:05.52 | starseeker | very exciting |
| 20:07.00 | starseeker | ``Erik: by the way, how does gettext play with Windows? |
| 20:07.36 | ``Erik | uhhhh, I d'no? I imagine it exists in cygwin? |
| 20:07.42 | starseeker | winces |
| 20:07.46 | ``Erik | windows are those things I look through when I want to see outside, dude |
| 20:07.52 | starseeker | hehe |
| 20:08.42 | juantelez | haha |
| 20:09.22 | starseeker | notes that his Mac doesn't have ANY of the posix locale variables set... |
| 20:09.51 | ``Erik | LC_ALL=en_BEAVIS_AND_BUTTHEAD |
| 20:10.38 | starseeker | ``Erik: hmm, some rather interesting possibilities there (and by interesting I mean disturbing) |
| 20:10.47 | brlcad | wooh, lotsa backlog |
| 20:10.50 | ``Erik | (amusingly, all the programs I've gettextized only managed to get a handful of en_ ones and pt_BR) |
| 20:11.19 | starseeker | juantelez, Nohla: I believe brlcad speaks some Spanish |
| 20:12.06 | Nohla | :) |
| 20:12.07 | ``Erik | starseeker: I've written beavis&butthead and redneck po files ... after seeing some sysadmin utility that had a flag to turn on b&b style messages... :) |
| 20:12.37 | ``Erik | (as for backlog, that'll teach brlcad to sleep.) |
| 20:12.49 | brlcad | ``Erik: presume that's like the old windows starfield screensaver? |
| 20:13.01 | ``Erik | brlcad: warp.c is, yes |
| 20:14.32 | brlcad | starseeker: heh, isst used to be hooked up to agar |
| 20:14.40 | brlcad | clanlib ftw! |
| 20:14.55 | Nohla | starseeker, what is on wikipedia brl is the same that is in /es ? |
| 20:15.01 | ``Erik | tried to write a worms armageddon clone with clanlib, didn't like it |
| 20:15.06 | Nohla | with different format |
| 20:15.26 | starseeker | Nohla: er, en you mean? |
| 20:15.32 | Nohla | or on the wiki, the explanation is clearer? |
| 20:15.40 | starseeker | BRL-CAD wiki content is probably older |
| 20:16.01 | starseeker | but more complete |
| 20:16.13 | starseeker | (docbook conversion is not complete in english either) |
| 20:16.45 | starseeker | but once you are comfortable with translating, definitely suggest working on lessons |
| 20:17.01 | starseeker | hundreds of pages of content there, most useful for beginners |
| 20:17.02 | Nohla | because, i was thinking that maybe, you souhld tell wich contents are completed and actualized |
| 20:17.09 | Nohla | to beginr with them |
| 20:17.38 | starseeker | doc/docbook/lessons is essentially complete |
| 20:18.30 | starseeker | content of lessons is from this document: http://brlcad.org/w/images/c/cf/Introduction_to_MGED.pdf |
| 20:18.35 | brlcad | and interesting about the bench.. it has checks in there for making sure it exists first |
| 20:18.49 | brlcad | should fall back to dc or other methods |
| 20:19.01 | starseeker | Nohla: that pdf is always first place for new users who speak english to go |
| 20:19.28 | starseeker | so its contents in doc/docbook/lessons are logical first translation, if not overwhelming |
| 20:19.32 | ``Erik | dc isn't on the box, either... silly embedded systems, not installing all those fancy tools |
| 20:20.02 | ``Erik | btclsh? expr ? :D |
| 20:20.20 | brlcad | hola Nohla y juantelez |
| 20:20.45 | Nohla | holas |
| 20:21.01 | Nohla | starseeker, this are the same pdf on wiki? |
| 20:21.22 | starseeker | same content as pdf on wiki, yes |
| 20:21.34 | Nohla | (sorry, i dont want to lose to much time looking for the best to transleate than translating) |
| 20:22.36 | starseeker | you want documentation for a new BRL-CAD user, correct? |
| 20:22.44 | brlcad | is still backlogging |
| 20:23.33 | Nohla | starseeker, give two things: 1) the best content to translate firs. 2) one advice about translating that |
| 20:24.16 | Nohla | so if i leave the proyect at tha first step, at least ive done something usefull :) |
| 20:24.21 | starseeker | Nohla: if there is no concern about amount of content, the lessons are best for new users |
| 20:24.30 | Nohla | every day i find new interesting things to do :) |
| 20:24.39 | starseeker | Nohla: any translation is useful |
| 20:25.16 | starseeker | for the request you had, lessons would help him the most |
| 20:25.52 | Nohla | http://brlcad.org/w/images/c/cf/Introduction_to_MGED.pdf this is for beginers? |
| 20:26.04 | starseeker | yes |
| 20:27.34 | Nohla | but imagine that you are a spanish speaking person and start reading that tuto |
| 20:28.03 | Nohla | read the firs you found and then you realise that there no more contents on spanish |
| 20:28.12 | Nohla | thats sad :( |
| 20:29.33 | Nohla | or worst, dont read anything because you saw that theres no all the content in your langage |
| 20:30.01 | Nohla | starseeker, question: the firs you gave me is the source code, really? |
| 20:30.29 | Nohla | that means that if you tipe for spanish help on console, you will read that? |
| 20:30.57 | Nohla | or if youre using brl and an advice is shown, that can be available on spanish? |
| 20:31.07 | Nohla | (sorry if the question is too stupid) |
| 20:33.52 | Nohla | (wow if i can translate 287 pages, i would be pride of myself! jejeje) |
| 20:35.55 | starseeker | Nohla: the various documentation and help systems in BRL-CAD do not have a unified design |
| 20:36.09 | starseeker | we are working on correcting that, and docbook will be the eventual solution |
| 20:37.02 | starseeker | but a FULL translation of all help strings in BRL-CAD would involve many changes in many places |
| 20:37.33 | Nohla | starseeker, i want to give you my mail for you to send me some information that you belive its usefull to translate |
| 20:37.56 | Nohla | im getting confused about wichi path to take because there is a lot of options |
| 20:38.13 | starseeker | my suggestion is doc/docbook/lessons |
| 20:38.21 | Nohla | and i dont know enough to choose correctly |
| 20:38.39 | Nohla | and what about pdf you sent me? |
| 20:38.42 | starseeker | without those, it is hard to use BRL-CAD at all and other translations are much less useful |
| 20:38.47 | starseeker | pdf has same content |
| 20:39.19 | Nohla | so if i do lesson, then you can drop that content on pdf |
| 20:39.20 | starseeker | doc/docbook/lessons contains the contents of that pdf |
| 20:39.24 | starseeker | yes |
| 20:39.35 | starseeker | we build the lessons as individual files |
| 20:39.58 | starseeker | so if you translate mged01_creating_primitive_shapes.xml we can make a pdf from that |
| 20:40.02 | starseeker | and html |
| 20:40.55 | brlcad | Nohla: podemos darte permiso a hacer 'commits' al repository si estas "active" con los traducciones |
| 20:41.08 | Nohla | but, at the same kind of thinking, if i translate the pdf, you can take what you need to drop that on lesson XD |
| 20:41.15 | Nohla | this is funny |
| 20:41.36 | starseeker | brlcad: help |
| 20:41.43 | starseeker | I'm not making myself clear |
| 20:41.44 | Nohla | brlcad, ive never translate anything before |
| 20:42.07 | brlcad | juantelez: thanks for helping be the intermediate translator :) |
| 20:42.14 | Nohla | starseeker, nono, im joking :) |
| 20:42.25 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 20:43.29 | Nohla | starseeker, anyway, my email is giudicejesica@gnutn.org.ar in case you want to guide this work in the foreward step :) |
| 20:43.38 | starseeker | thank you :-) |
| 20:43.59 | starseeker | I suggest doing a spanish translation of mged01_creating_primitive_shapes.xml |
| 20:44.25 | starseeker | email that to brlcad-devel, and from there we will take the next steps |
| 20:45.55 | Nohla | so i should translate all te words in white ;) |
| 20:48.31 | starseeker | depends on what vim syntax highlighting you have on ;-) |
| 20:48.48 | juantelez | brlcad: :D, my pleassure |
| 20:59.02 | ``Erik | dons his dunce cap. *sigh* |
| 20:59.08 | CIA-41 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r36791 10/isst/trunk/src/gui.c: set project id on local load (fixes ignored motion events) |
| 21:09.39 | CIA-41 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r36792 10/isst/trunk/src/gui.c: restore perspective rendering when leaving shotline mode |
| 21:31.42 | CIA-41 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r36793 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/metaball/metaball.c: shelling |
| 21:59.31 | CIA-41 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r36794 10/isst/trunk/src/gui.c: save a shotline |
| 22:14.12 | brlcad | okay, all caught up with the backlog... |
| 22:15.21 | brlcad | Nohla: si te puedes quedar en IRC, me gustaria ayudarte a empezar |
| 22:16.16 | Nohla | brlcad, estoy |
| 22:16.24 | Nohla | pero la verdad que vengo mas o menos bien |
| 22:16.34 | Nohla | perdon |
| 22:16.45 | Nohla | actually, im doing right |
| 22:17.50 | Nohla | but i need time because i have to study |
| 22:18.25 | Nohla | i pay an exam on monday |
| 22:21.33 | Nohla | i like translate this more than study :P |
| 22:29.14 | brlcad | Nohla: jeje, que bien |
| 22:31.15 | brlcad | pues, lo que starseeker dijo eåaa cierto .. empezando con los lecciones ayuda mucho, tambien puedes empezar con el introduccion aqui http://brlcad.org/d/about |
| 22:31.28 | brlcad | yeesh, my unicode isn't working right.. |
| 22:42.25 | Nohla | starseeker, send me an email to keep in touch |
| 22:43.08 | Nohla | anyway, at the end of the first translate ill send the file by your list |
| 22:43.29 | Nohla | if you have restriction about that, please moderate my message |
| 22:43.57 | brlcad | restriction? |
| 22:45.14 | Nohla | about de size of the file |
| 22:45.34 | Nohla | i have a list with that restriction |
| 22:45.47 | brlcad | no hay restriction, pero si tienes que ser suscrito a la lista para enviar un mensaje |
| 22:46.23 | brlcad | https://sourceforge.net/projects/brlcad/lists |
| 22:46.44 | Nohla | well, in this list, if you are not subscripted and send a message, me or juantelez have to accep it before |
| 22:47.06 | brlcad | ah, pues ours will just reject it ;) |
| 22:47.22 | brlcad | con instrucciones a subscribe |
| 22:47.35 | brlcad | (automaticamente) |
| 22:47.40 | Nohla | noo |
| 22:47.45 | Nohla | thats bad |
| 22:47.49 | Nohla | :P |
| 22:48.58 | Nohla | i was talking about a email list, not a sourceforge list ;) |
| 22:49.21 | brlcad | subscribing is pretty easy, if people aren't willing to do that to engage in a discussion, it's not usually a productive discussion |
| 22:49.32 | brlcad | sourceforge lists are email lists |
| 22:49.37 | brlcad | mailman |
| 22:50.10 | Nohla | aha, i see |
| 22:51.24 | Nohla | I dont know to much of all resources on internet |
| 22:51.41 | brlcad | our lists used to be moderated, but 99% of the moderations were spam and a waste of time to have to reject/ignore daily |
| 22:51.45 | Nohla | well, i dont know too much of anything :) |
| 22:51.52 | Nohla | even english :D |
| 22:51.53 | brlcad | Nohla: you're english is pretty good :) |
| 22:52.17 | brlcad | more than good enough to communicate usefully |
| 22:52.24 | Nohla | well, thanks |
| 22:53.08 | Nohla | im leaving, i have to live my life sometimes :P |
| 22:53.14 | brlcad | ``Erik: the shelling bug is pretty blatent :) |
| 22:53.36 | Nohla | from time to time, I remember I have a family |
| 22:53.51 | brlcad | ``Erik: setting the in/out hit distances wrong .. you're making a 1mm shell |
| 22:54.03 | brlcad | Nohla: jaja |
| 22:54.11 | brlcad | pues esta bien |
| 22:54.13 | brlcad | gracies |
| 22:54.17 | brlcad | er, gracias! |
| 22:54.20 | Nohla | :) |
| 22:54.36 | Nohla | saludos! y buen fin de semana para todos |
| 22:54.40 | brlcad | siempre estamos aqui |
| 22:54.46 | brlcad | ciao |
| 22:55.00 | brlcad | igualmente |
| 23:09.34 | ``Erik | brlcad; pretty sure something in my stepping function si getting flipped somewhere to cause that... |
| 23:09.46 | ``Erik | probably that stat variable |
| 23:11.42 | brlcad | regardless of the stepping, you're setting in to out+1 |
| 23:11.52 | brlcad | or out to in+1 |
| 23:11.54 | brlcad | which can't be right |
| 23:11.57 | ``Erik | oh, hrm |
| 23:12.14 | ``Erik | um, thought I set something like that to get off the surface to start the walk again |
| 23:12.31 | brlcad | you don't set in/outs anywhere else |
| 23:12.43 | brlcad | so you end up with 1mm shells being reported back |
| 23:13.27 | ``Erik | will have to look into it... next week O.o |
| 23:13.40 | brlcad | should back out the ray outside the metaball bounding box too, count all surface hits, then clamp to the ray origin |
| 23:13.58 | brlcad | that should take care of it |
| 23:27.36 | CIA-41 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r36795 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: iteration task fail. 64-bit and annotation are incomplete. move them down. also add deprecation of the dbfind command. |
| 23:32.25 | CIA-41 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r36796 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: new configure option for strict build compilation. this flag, enabled by default, causes the core libraries to consider all compilation warnings as errors and can report C standard compliance failures. |
| 23:53.22 | CIA-41 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r36797 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: vdeck command truncates the region names in the 'regions' file |
