IRC log for #brlcad on 20120527

00:00.33 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03tbrowder2 * r50711 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/README.Linux: freeglut not required based on last test with Linux Mint LMDE
01:10.32 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03tbrowder2 * r50712 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/vls.c: change macros to local const ints
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05:27.57 crdueck <PROTECTED>
05:28.11 crdueck whoops, this isnt vim
06:19.07 starseeker for those using emacs and sh/indent.sh, you want to verify (especially the first time you use it) that the result is actually the formatting specified by our standards. There have been issues with some OS/emacs versions in the past
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13:23.22 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r50713 10/brlcad/trunk/include/rtgeom.h: apply the patch file from crdueck's sf patch 3528940 (ell_centroid) that documents the ell parameters.
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14:33.29 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03Phoenix 07http://brlcad.org * r3739 10/wiki/User:Phoenix/GSoc2012/Reports: /* Week 1 */
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14:48.01 _fkr Any luck with getting 7.20.6 compiling on Mac OS (10.4)? I've seen quite old binaries around for that system. I guess not many people are in to that?
14:49.38 _fkr Been trying for the past few days... Now I ran in to next problem. g_diff.c:175 shadows a global declaration in /usr/include/signal.h (int kill;)
14:51.32 _fkr I guess I could just modify the g_diff.c and name a variable called kill in function compare_external to be something else... Perhaps I should try compiling without threads instead?
14:51.46 _fkr Or let compiler ignore warnings
14:52.18 _fkr It could compile then, but I guess it would not be a suggested way...
14:52.45 brlcad _fkr: lots of folks use mac for dev (myself included)
14:53.04 brlcad the binaries just don't get updated because there's not a dedicated mac maintainer
14:53.14 _fkr Nice... any suggestions for what to enable/disable and so on to make things smoother?
14:53.27 _fkr I dont care, I can try to compile myself like I'm doing right now.
14:53.53 _fkr Upgraded autotools, tcl/tk and so on, now got it compiling for a while already... just ran into the next obstacle
14:54.19 _fkr I suspect, that if I'd turn the threads off (default), perhaps it would pass this file...
14:54.21 louipc disable strict if you run into a problem
14:54.38 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r50714 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/g_diff.c: rename kill to killit to avoid a shadow warning on mac 10.4 (reported by _fkr via irc)
14:54.40 _fkr cc1: warnings being treated as errors <- at the moment
14:54.57 brlcad that's why it's stopping, it defaults to strict compile
14:55.11 brlcad unless you're doing development or reporting build failures, you can just turn strict off
14:55.37 _fkr yeah, I looked at the source, it would probably not be a prob, but I guess it should be addressed. Closing eyes in front of warnings is bad engineering practice, I gifure
14:55.41 brlcad doesn't affect anything negatively, the strictness relates to code cleanliness, not correct/incorrect functionality
14:56.34 louipc can they can hint to potential vulnerabilities too?
14:57.47 brlcad sometimes, but pretty rare
14:58.18 brlcad especially once the code is already scrubbed (like ours was years ago) once
14:58.32 louipc hehe
14:58.43 brlcad in this case, it's just platform variability .. 10.4 doesn't get tested so the older headers are going to have subtle name conflicts
14:59.19 _fkr I'm trying with tcl/tk at the moment, but I'll probably want to try later enabling OpenGL and AGL. I just could not figure out yet, hot to make the system understand where to find the OpenGL and AGL libraries and stuff on Mac OS?
14:59.37 _fkr I can help with 10.4 testing, when I have time. Testing building right now as you can see...
14:59.57 brlcad it's going to build as an Tk/X11 application on mac even with/without opengl/agl enabled
15:00.40 _fkr I might try without threads.
15:01.10 brlcad fails to see what threading has to do with any of this...
15:01.40 _fkr yeah, I understand and this is what I'm doing, but it's interesting to build with different options later in order to see what I might like more...
15:01.44 brlcad testing 10.4 isn't the issue -- I have a 10.4 system nearby somewhere, they're just non-issues
15:02.25 brlcad threading won't really change anything as that option just pertains to the tcl interpreter
15:02.32 _fkr perhaps that's why the /usr/include/signal.h gets included?
15:02.46 brlcad signal.h is used all over the place, nothing to do with threading
15:03.05 brlcad pertains to signal handling
15:03.17 brlcad it'll get used on any unix/mac/linux based system
15:03.21 _fkr ah, I guess modifying the source would be ok.
15:03.37 _fkr renaming that kill in g_diff
15:03.51 brlcad already did that in r50714
15:04.11 _fkr ahh, nice...
15:05.04 brlcad still, that's a perfect example of a case where strict provides basically negative value -- there's no harm in that variable having been named 'kill', so the warning is counterproductive
15:05.24 brlcad if they were all like that, strict wouldn't even be an option to enable and certainly wouldn't be the default
15:05.26 _fkr Yeah.
15:06.18 brlcad if you don't even have a compile, I strongly suggest just turning strict off to see if there are any real issues preventing your build
15:07.44 brlcad strict is meant to keep things clean on the newest compilation environments, not make the build harder on legacy systems
15:08.59 _fkr yeah, that's also a possibility. To get at least something running at start and then later start looking more closely.
15:10.10 _fkr Well, I'm happy that I've got to the compiling process already. Spent a bit of time upgrading various parts of the system to get autogen.sh working and get past ./configure. Like I mentioned, I'm on 10.4, which is quite outdated.
15:11.20 _fkr I'm trying with -O3 and tuning for G4 processor.
15:14.22 _fkr What's that Ray trace OpenGL display manager about? Not compiling it in at the moment because I couldnt figure out how to tell the build enivronment where to locate OpenGL
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15:45.03 brlcad _fkr: don't worry about it, no loss in functionality
15:45.27 brlcad we have a variety of display managers that use different methods for drawing, but all do the same thing regardless of the method
15:45.33 Stattrav brlcad: Can I have a few benchmark log files ?
15:45.40 brlcad the only thing disabled with opengl disabled is archer
15:45.54 brlcad Stattrav: sure, run benchmark a few times ;)
15:46.01 Stattrav as in which have been obtained from folks who have mailed it to benchmark@brlcad.org so as to check diversity of platforms
15:46.11 Stattrav brlcad: I did that I have some 6 different files
15:46.48 Stattrav from various runs, I want to see the ones from bsd systems or windows machines.
15:47.07 Stattrav they should be the same as the script(bench/run.sh) functions that way
15:49.22 brlcad it'll take a little time, at least more than I have right now, to pull some together and upload them somewhere to you
15:49.46 brlcad so just go with what you have or see if you can get someone else here to run the benchmark for you and send you their log file
15:50.11 brlcad otherwise, it shouldn't matter too much if you parse the files flexibly enough
15:51.21 _fkr No loss in functionality, but would there be notable performance differences? I'm not worrying about it anyways. Just want to get a fresh install compiled... I have rel-7.10.4 hanging around in my system. Dates to 2007.
15:51.23 brlcad Stattrav: a bit late, but might I suggest a different way of parsing the files would be to define each field of interest, and then specifically parse out that field using pattenrs
15:51.32 brlcad instead of parsing the whole file looking for everything all at once
15:51.48 brlcad _fkr: yes, the non-opengl display manager is much faster
15:52.24 brlcad for relatively small models at least
15:52.25 _fkr the tcl/tk one?
15:52.42 brlcad no
15:52.50 brlcad the x11 one
15:53.22 _fkr Hey, looks like a successful build: BRL-CAD Release 7.20.6, Build 20120527... I'll install it in a while.
15:54.27 _fkr I basically don't like the aqua environment too much anyways. Just got stuck with mac os years ago when I bought some hardware and it was a bit painful to get other soft running on it
16:02.30 Stattrav brlcad: that is what I am doing, patterns as per the run.sh file
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16:14.25 _fkr Where are you using that information? Just curious about various systems or you want to publish it somewhere?
16:14.46 Stattrav _fkr: are you talking about benchmark data ?
16:15.09 _fkr Yes
16:15.20 _fkr Sorry, should had used your name when talking to you
16:15.24 Stattrav http://brlcad.org/wiki/Benchmark_Performance_Database
16:16.21 Stattrav yes, that is the objective. To publish the results graphically or otherwise
16:16.32 Stattrav ofcourse on the webpage of brlcad
16:17.13 brlcad Stattrav: you know, you can ask others for their log files... ;)
16:17.26 brlcad opportunities, just like this
16:17.45 Stattrav brlcad: sending a mail out to the other SoC participants
16:17.50 brlcad no
16:18.04 brlcad well, that's not what I meant at least
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16:18.19 Stattrav aah
16:18.23 _fkr try to get compile time option information included too. Whether the build was optimised for speed or size or was it tuned for a specific processor and so on. And what grpahics card was used.
16:18.28 brlcad your right here talking to someone about the benchmark, but curiously haven't asked him for his log file
16:18.46 Stattrav aah :)
16:19.02 Stattrav _fkr: could I ask you the benchmark file of your installation ?
16:19.49 _fkr hehe, Dunno. I basically did a benchmark run straight after a build got out of the oven. I had other programs running in background too and perhaps it wouldnt be that accurate.
16:20.18 _fkr approx 661 times faster than ref machince. Perhaps if I shut a few progs down I'll make it to 666
16:21.10 _fkr you need the summary? Ther eare diff files generated by benchmark as I can see.
16:21.19 Stattrav _fkr: ahaha, could you please upload it somewhere and thus give me a link or just send it to me as an email suryajith1987[at]gmail.
16:21.47 Stattrav _fkr: the one which says run-<somedigits>-benchmark.log
16:22.04 _fkr I'll consider it. I might run it on another machine that is similar but with slower cpu
16:22.23 Stattrav _fkr: machines dont really matter btw. Thanks
16:22.31 brlcad _fkr: he's using the log files for his project, not using your statistics specifically
16:23.02 brlcad he needs a variety to make sure he's reading the log file correctly
16:23.15 brlcad so getting an old mac 10.4 log would be useful to him
16:23.35 _fkr ahh, I thought it was about making comparison of diff machines. Ok.
16:24.53 brlcad he's working on a website you'll be able to go for seeing how your performance compares to others with different or similar hardware
16:25.23 brlcad or even comparing to different operating systems, so you could see if performance changes going from 10.4 to 10.6 for example
16:25.37 brlcad right now, though, it's very very basic -- he's just trying to read the log file :)
16:25.38 Stattrav yup
16:25.55 brlcad so he needs a variety of log files
16:26.48 _fkr Just keep it simple and one needs to start from somewhere. Having a quick basic solution up at early stages is a good start I think.
16:27.26 brlcad if you have access to other operating systems or hardware, other logs would be helpful too
16:28.54 _fkr yeah, I could try on some other systems too... I guess the time is a factor. I spend too much time off keyboard. Soon it's blue monday and I need to get my thoughts off the benchmarks and stuff.
16:33.31 Stattrav _fkr: its fine, whenever you can push them through. not in a hurry.
16:34.44 _fkr What do you use brl-cad for, Stat? You need it for work or you just have fun with it?
16:36.40 Stattrav _fkr: work for me is theoretical CS. so its GSoC for me at the moment(that is the summers) after which it'd be contributions which you could call fun.
16:37.30 _fkr Nice.
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16:39.16 brlcad hi cristina
16:39.28 cristina hi brlcad
16:40.00 _fkr How's your life, Cristina? Everything all right?
16:40.28 cristina _fkr: yes, it's everything alright. Thanks for asking :). How's yours?
16:41.44 _fkr Well, It's how I make it to be, I guess. It's my own choice, but I guess it's more or less all right. Gonna be better and better, if I work for it...
16:44.59 cristina _fkr: same here, it depends mostly on me whether things are ok or not
16:45.09 _fkr didnt hang out too much this weekend... well, that means more time behind keyboard. Wanted to go out friday, but managed to fall asleep with my clothes on, like it sometimes happens at fridays. Saturday I went out, but it sucked so I moved back quickly. Less hangover and more time for other things...
16:46.07 _fkr Depends a lot on human relationships and shit like that. How well you get along with people you run in to on a daily basis.
16:48.12 cristina ok course it does, but this is up to you
16:50.26 cristina s/ok/of
16:50.28 _fkr Yeah, best is probably just to take it easy and try to change what one can instead of spending energy on something that doesnt produce a useful result.
16:56.44 _fkr Do things tend to be more often ok, rather than not, from your point of view?
16:57.22 cristina I'd say more often not :)
16:57.33 _fkr laughs evilly
16:58.08 _fkr Music is nice. I like to listen to music. Helps with the mood sometimes.
16:59.17 cristina I used to listen to music
16:59.40 _fkr Well, enjoy it at least and take what you can from unpleasant situations. I mean it's just about where one looks at it. The viewpoint. Try to look from a diff angle, if you do not like, what you see. Perhaps hard experiences give valuable experiences and additional problem solving skills or something else good...
17:01.38 cristina this is my realistic way of seeing things; it doesn't mean that it harms me
17:04.30 _fkr Like Epicurus once thought: "So death, the most terrifying of ills, is nothing to us, since so long as we exist, death is not with us; but when death comes, then we do not exist. It does not then concern either the living or the dead, since for the former it is not, and the latter are no more."
17:08.15 cristina _fkr: you are in a very philosofical mood today :)
17:09.44 _fkr Hehe, I do not even know, whether that might be good or not. Too much thinking might start to distract sometimes. Doesnt let one concentrate on things and so on.
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17:11.41 cristina better than not thinking at all :)
17:12.17 _fkr Yeah. Having the right balance is the key, I bet...
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17:22.32 _fkr Latest build emitted a "ranlib: file: .libs/libbrlcad.a(simphysics.o) has no symbols"
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17:54.34 _fkr ANother thing I noticed after install. I used --prefix and --exec-prefix for architecture dependent files. After install I see in --prefix/bin there is one file called enigma, which is still arch dependent, I believe, whereas other binaries are in --exec-prefix/bin, like expected...
17:58.49 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03Anuragmurty 07http://brlcad.org * r3740 10/wiki/User:Anuragmurty: /* community bonding period */
18:14.39 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03Anoop 07http://brlcad.org * r3741 10/wiki/User:Anoop: /* Personal information */
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18:19.39 _fkr Hmm, i set the EPREFIX/bin to my PATH as well... Tried mged and gave it a raytrace job. Looks like it is still looking for rt in PREFIX/bin, rather than EPREFIX/bin. Well, I do not have any other architecture files in that tree, so I could just move the EPREFIX/* files to PREFIX dir, but I guess it's better to mention about it.
18:25.58 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03Anoop 07http://brlcad.org * r3742 10/wiki/User:Anoop: /* Development Logs */
18:27.24 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03Anoop 07http://brlcad.org * r3743 10/wiki/User:Anoop/Logs: /* ToDo */
18:28.32 _fkr Sup, Cristina? Preparing for the blue monday?
18:39.29 cristina_ _fkr: you're not encouraging me
18:40.11 cristina_ feels lazier
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18:47.52 Stattrav its the summer monday/sunday shouldnt really matter i guess
18:50.39 _fkr Yeah, I guess it depends a lot.
18:57.01 _fkr I wonder if one can customize the path where mged looks for binaries, if I'm at the mged console. Could it be written to .mgedrc for example or a command be sent to mged? Is it just fixed and compiled in?
19:09.50 _fkr Well, I can at least try and put more effort in it, if it would make you feel more comfortable. Just did not knew how you felt.
19:10.34 _fkr I can be lazy as well, but I try to learn to push myself further. Lots of things I should do, but I know that it can be hard to stand up and start acting.
19:11.14 _fkr How to find motivation? You have a good way? Where to get the necessary will-power to get through the daily grind and other shit that life throws at ya?
19:11.56 _fkr Think nice and pleasant thoughts. If you feel better, it's easier to find motivation to do anything.
19:12.42 _fkr You probably like to do something? Perhaps you feel that you are not able to do the things you want to do and need to deal more with unpleasant stuff? That's what drags you down?
19:14.40 _fkr tries to encourage Cristina to face the new week with slightly aggressive and energetic attitude.
19:20.45 _fkr opens up a small bottle of liqueur and thinks: "this is nice in the morning too..."
19:24.01 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03tbrowder2 * r50715 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (5 files): split function bu_vls_vprintf into its own src file, put common vls data into a new internal header, modify build structure accordingly
19:41.36 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03tbrowder2 * r50716 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/vls_vprintf.c: move vars to file scope, change some back to macros because intializers aren't constant
19:41.45 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03Anoop 07http://brlcad.org * r3744 10/wiki/User:Anoop/Logs:
19:42.46 kanzure what?
19:44.51 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03Anoop 07http://brlcad.org * r3745 10/wiki/User:Anoop/Logs: /* ToDo */
19:45.34 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03Anoop 07http://brlcad.org * r3746 10/wiki/User:Anoop/Logs: /* ToDo */
20:06.03 _fkr Ok, I got a workaround byt using BRLCAD_ROOT to point to EPREFIX. Now it can find rt... earlier it was able to locate tire for example, but failed with rt, assuming it was in PREFIX/bin
20:09.27 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03tbrowder2 * r50717 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/vls_vprintf.c: move struct and its reset function to the top
20:09.59 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03tbrowder2 * r50718 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/vls_vprintf.c: correct comment
20:18.21 cristina_ _fkr: that should do it!
20:18.33 cristina_ \me cheers, _fkr!
20:18.45 cristina_ cheers, _fkr!
20:18.59 _fkr Nice. Glad to see you happy.
20:20.13 _fkr Well, it's not easy, but it's doable. Just need to work with yourself on a daily basis.
20:21.19 _fkr Solve problems and evolve to be a better problem solver in the process... In the future similar problems seem a lot more simpler and you might even laugh about it how you used to take it all too seriously back in the days...
20:24.52 _fkr So what else is up? What are you doing there?
20:26.15 _fkr I'm starting to feel a bit hungry and am thinking about whether I should go out and grab a bite or should I just rest and eat later. Need to do shit soon anyways, so not too many hours left for resting...
20:27.26 _fkr drinks a bit of liqueur that has a pleasant and a bit sweet taste
20:28.08 cristina_ _fkr: are you talking to me? I'm reading something about adaptagrams
20:29.56 _fkr Yeah. Oh, that's nice. Reading and learning might be good at times. I'll try not to distract that much.
20:30.37 _fkr I'm already thinking about monday so it's hard to concentrate on anything. Just music and relaxing for me.
20:31.06 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03tbrowder2 * r50719 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/vls_vprintf.c: add target specifications for bu_vls_vprintf
20:32.19 cristina_ _fkr: here is already Monday :)
20:32.53 _fkr Have a nice monday morning then. Enjoy it, while you can.
20:33.45 _fkr Waking up too early is hard for me, otherwise it might not be that bad.
20:45.01 CIA-65 BRL-CAD: 03tbrowder2 * r50720 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/vls_vprintf.c: modify and expand specification, remove underscore from internal function names
21:46.06 *** join/#brlcad yukonbob (~bch@50.46.78.234)
21:46.14 yukonbob hello, #brlcad
21:46.45 crdueck hi yukonbob
21:47.01 yukonbob howdy crdueck
21:58.27 _fkr What's up with y'all?
21:58.46 _fkr Havin' fun?
22:16.12 _fkr Damn, it. Was just looking around, searching for a certain bottle. I walked around and tried to remember. It was on the floor just between my legs in the place where I sat and started looking for it... another object obstructed the view, so that's why I missed it.
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